I've never understood how surrendering control over our borders, legal system, and society makes us anything other than weaker. Europe is damaging its position in the world with its bureacracy and idealism. Greece is the perfect example of reality not matching the idealism, thanks to blatant dishonesty and tax evasion.

I get the bureacracy bit, nobody's pretending the EU is ideal; bits of it desperately need reform.

What I don't get is the surrendering control stuff.

We have a reciprocal arrangement for free movement of people and goods; a sharin of a small amount of sovereignty. How on earth would modern trade work if mainland Europe retained all it's border rossings with checks and duty differences etc?

Our legal system remains our own. We have our own courts and tribunals and an adversarial system completely at odds with those of say France or Germany. OK we're signatories to the Human Rights Convention which in reality gives us in UK some sort of a proxy for a written constitution. But the vast majority of our legislation is domestic only. What in the last four Queen's Speeches was determined by Europe?

There are a handful of egregious examples of bad behaviour by EU folks resident here and a few more we'd exclude in an ideal world. But again do we want to surrender our right to work and travel in other countries without let or hindrance? Cos that's the choice.

Edited by Bromptonaut on 06/01/2015 at 22:54

My Caterham is a mixture of metric and imperial fastners. Not an issue to me since I understand the difference but many owners have damaged parts assembling them using the wrong product.

Mine has what is referred to as an "Imperial Chassis". Basically that means that all the bolts that attach components directly to it should have Imperial threads but even then there are a few exceptions. The lower diff mouting bolts are specials having a 10mm thread and a 1/2" shank and the bolt for the gearbox rubber is also 10mm thread. All the suspension mounting bolts are metric.

On my current car all the bolts that attach the rear suspension are imperial but all the bolts related to Ford Sierra brake and diff componets are metric as are all the bolts in the gearbox (Sierra again). The current engine is a Zetec and is all metric again.

The front uprights and original brakes are directly related to the Triumph Spitfire parts thus have imperial fastners. The uprated brakes now on the car are a mixture of imperial and metric.

The original engine was a Ford X-Flow and that was mostly UNC externally with mostly UNF internally to add to the confusion. All Mk1 and 2 Escort 1100, 1300 and 1600's had metric gearboxes with imperial axles and engines.

Just to add to the confusion Mr Ford uses metric fine thread in some locations.

Had a Maestro diesel. IIRC imperial body fixings but the Perkins diesel and VW gearbox weren't.

Railways are going fully metric because everything is built in metric countries and most of the franchises are foreign owned - and the cost to change isn't that high.

The cost to change UK roads and vehicles would be humungous - and the benefit value about zero. It would be change for principles sake.