Hello all,
Well I'm going to buck the trend. I've had 3 audis, I've been on multiple test drives prior to buying each one and I'm more than happy with all of them. I've had an a3,a4 and lastly a q3.
Some off the comments do bring a smile to my face. Dismissing an a6 as to dull when your present car is an Octavia estate, I d find it easier to take the comment seriously if you were changing from a genuinely exciting car.
I completely accept the car choice is personal. One mans poison and all that.
Looking at the amount of audis on the road however they can't be that bad.
My personal experience is that the worst dealership I encountered was a Mercedes dealership. According to their salesman every brand paled into obscurity compared to the merc.
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An Audi dealer was the source.
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An Audi dealer was the source.
I wonder what the difference is, if any, between company car choosers including any form of funding and genuine private sales.
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I think there is something in the fact that many people tend to stick to the same make so don't bother with test drive.
I guess that with Audi and VW, many of the sales will be on the company so the users again will just place an order.
And I agree that there are definite signs of "VW driver types" going the same way as Audi drivers in terms of attitude, self belief and so on, especially Golfs. There is definitely a sort of "attitude".
I've often wondered what it must be like to work for prestige makes that seemingly sell themselves. I shouldn't think it's that easy and they will still be under pressure to sell the extras, the service packages, GAP, polish, blingy rubber band wheels.
Anyway, I rather like the look of new Skoda Octavia - I know it's no surprise but I think it actually looks a Lidle bit like the Aldi it shares so much DNA with. I wonder whether there will be a similar Skoda attitude? I think at the moment, it still benefits from the reverse badge snobbery, which makes me smile. I think I'll have a SEAT down now.
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Chris79, I've had over 30 cars, so I do know dull. Just because the car I had at the time was an Octavia HATCH, not estate, as you misread, doesn't mean I can't tell a dull one when I drive it. And, just because I had an Octavia I don't necessarily want annother unexciting car. Thankfully my current car is fun to drive. I enjoy every journey and look forward to each one. The Octavia 90 bhp diesel MK1 never was fun, but it did what I needed at the time, very well.
I buy a car on it's merits, not for the badge.
BTW, test drove an A4 too. More refined than an Octavia, but still understeered. I had too many years of that with the Octy to want to endure it again, and I do like a car with some steering finesse that goes where you point it in corners, rather than wanting to carry straight on. A mate had a S Line A4T estate, too much understeer for him.
Edited by Trilogy on 27/05/2013 at 22:51
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There's a lot of stereotyping going on in this thread, isn't there!
You don't buy a 90 bhp Octavia and expcect it to be fun to drive: it's a workhorse, and a good one. It depends on the model: my vRS has a Golf GTI engine and goes as well as you'd expect.
If you see this, Chris 79, can you tell us how you like your Q3? It's a possibility for me as a retirement car to keep for some time, and has the advantage (as one gets older) that you don't have to climb either up or down to get in and out of it.
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Goodmorning Avant.
Don't know where else to put this post, the rest have been spammed.
I'd forget the Q3 for the next few hours once you sign on thismorning Avant..:) you've got two Spammers who've resurrected umpteen old threads to flog their wares, happy deleting.
The two sites are noted (thanks for putting your heads up for sniper fire spammers), they are the very last places i would ever contact should i or anyone i know need tyre supply or car scrapping services.
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Avant - I tried reporting the spam posts as offensive but the forum software just goes to a std page identifying an error has occurred.
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Avant
I've only had the q3 for a month and 1000 miles so its early days, however I like the following:
Deeper profile tyres give a better ride than the a4 2.0 tdie that it replaced.
Higher seating position makes access / egress easy.
Better stereo that comes with audi music interface as standard, allowing control of the iPod.
It handles well enough for me although I'm not a driver who pushes it to hard.
The se spec I opted for doesn't have the xenon headlights that I wanted to avoid.
Fuel economy at present with a mixture of driving is approx 47 mpg, I'm expecting it to get better.
Dislikes:
I've lost my auto dimming rear view mirror that the a4 had.
I had to pay 75 pounds for a space saver wheel, apparently I'm told due to the level of Deane for these they will shortly be a std fit. This also reduces boot capacity slightly.
Finally the parcel shelf is not much use. Due to the design of the boot when you open the tailgate the main parcel shelf remains in situ. The boot opening would not allow it to be raised by string in the usual manner. A far better mechanism would be the roller type as used in the a4 avant.
Incidentally in a pure bit of coincidence I was tailgates today by a skoda Octavia. Are they the new audi drivers.......
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I like the look of the Q3, but Audi's rather average reliability makes me turn away.
I have to say that BMW drivers are still by far the worst as a whole, IMO
I'm all for being an aggressive driver, but when it borders on dangerous and/or idiotic, its gone too far
Edited by balleballe on 29/05/2013 at 10:13
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I ve never had any trouble with the audis I have had. That said each of them has been 2 yeas old and approx 35k on the clock when I've got rid. Perhaps not the best indicator of long term reliability.
Purely as a general note when I chose the q3 it came down to a choice between a Kia sportage, skoda superb and the q3.
The sportage was excellent but was unrefined at motorway speed which ruled it out. The superb is a fantastic car, but I wanted a diesel. They offered a great 20% of petrol models but nothing off a diesel. I know 20% of list price covers a lot of fuel but it didn't change the fact I wanted a diesel.
Audi offered me 4k of an a4 avant diesel and I got a good discount of the q3 although no where near 4k sadly.
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That said each of them has been 2 yeas old and approx 35k on the clock when I've got rid. Perhaps not the best indicator of long term reliability.
More the sign of someone who IS concerned about their long-term reliability and wants to get rid early.
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Not really. It's the sign of some one who likes cars and gets itchy feet quickly. I would have quite happily sold any of my cars to a family member. Well looked after cars with a known provenance.
I can quite honestly say these cars long term reliability never bothered me. I am intending to keep my q3 now for six years and am quite unworried by the prospect.
Whilst people on this forum make some very valid points about various Marques failings it is also true that there are some very satisfied owners out there. You seldom hear from them.
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VAG sell a massive amount of cars, so the chance of hearing about their problems is increased
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I like the look of the Q3, but Audi's rather average reliability makes me turn away.
I have to say that BMW drivers are still by far the worst as a whole, IMO
I'm all for being an aggressive driver, but when it borders on dangerous and/or idiotic, its gone too far
You're all for being an agressive driver? That sort of attitude causes accidents, so is dangerous by its very nature. You'd fit the stereotypical "Audi driver" to a tee driving like that. There's a great difference between a confident driver and an agressive (likely arrogant) one.
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What you call confident others may call aggressive.
I accelerate quickly in the lower gears where appropriate and I dont appreciate people in the fast lane who are not overtaking or those who do not move to the left. I think I am a reasonable driver, but nowhere near perfect
I dont tailgate people or move lanes quickly without indicating and I dont cut people up.
If that makes me dangerous or arrogant in your view, then so be it.
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Perhaps the choice of "agressive" was a poor choice of words on your part. Good (and confident) driving is all about driving to the prevailing road and weather conditions and to ensure other road users can do so without the need for sudden and potentially dangerous manouvres and to be respectful of all road users and pedestrians.
Many of your points are valid (2nd/3rd para) - but I would caution against over confidence, hence why "defensive driving" is normally considered to be the most appropriate (this does not mean going slow or hogging the middle/3rd lanes [which I hate with a passion]), but driving in a manner that gives others the best opportunity to know what you're going to do and pre-empt poor driving from others, especially if they are inexperienced. I'd rather assume that all other drivers are potentially of that type (as opposed to really good) as its just not worth taking big risks, given the possible consequences.
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My definition of 'defensive driving' is to remember that the roads are full of inattentive/unskilled/demented drivers who may at any moment do something hazardous to your health, and therefore be ready to take the necessary action.
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I had an Adui A4 TDI bought sh with full Audi SH and 70 k miles..(cambelt changed on schedule etc).
I did a further 30k miles in 2 years and had it serviced by Audi. It was under warrnty - bought from an Audi dealer - and it had the following replaced.
Both front suspension arms and joints,catalyst, rear exhaust, cambelt and all tensioners etc when the engine was covered in steel filings when a ballrace failed in the belt drive train, air conditioning condenser - all under warranty - and the battery ( not under warranty).
It was a great advert for changing cars regularly and treating Audi cars as expensive and over-rated junk.
As far as driving is concerned, having seen a driver on the M6 swerve from lane 1 to 2 to 3 and back again when he fell asleep!.. I treat others as potential killers and drive accordingly.
Edited by madf on 29/05/2013 at 18:04
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My definition of 'defensive driving' is to remember that the roads are full of inattentive/unskilled/demented drivers who may at any moment do something hazardous to your health, and therefore be ready to take the necessary action.
I was diplomatically trying to say that without making it look like I was making my driving skills out to be superior to others or making it look like the other poster was a poor driver. You are correct in your definition - I couldn't have put it better myself - its all about pre-empting and anticipation of possible poor driving by others and making sure our own actions are both obvious and (potentially) hazardous to others to reduce the risk of accidents to a low level.
A shame a good deal of Audi drivers (and many other German car owners in my view as well) do not subscribe to this view - probably why as are held in low regard by other road users.
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Aberdeen is teeming with Audis and I have to say they seem to be the 'new BMWs', frequently being driven aggressively by pushy, arrogant, incompetent twerps with no regard for the safety of either themselves or other road users. I'm unsurprised many of them don't test drive the cars as they apparently have little idea how to drive in the first place.
The cars are mostly dull, overpriced, seemingly pretty unreliable and seem to be bought en masse by conformist, consumerist numpties in the apparently mistaken belief that they are impressing someone.
The German car brands seem to be trading off a reputation for quality and reliability, forged in the '80s and early '90s, which is no longer justfied.
Just my 2p...
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The German car brands seem to be trading off a reputation for quality and reliability, forged in the '80s and early '90s, which is no longer justfied.
Just my 2p...
The majority are well aware of this. I imagine most of those that drive the German brands are aware of this also. But the 'premium badge' is a must for some people.
It's fair enough I suppose, we all have different priorities
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Although I don't know from first hand experience, but I perceive that all the premium and luxury brands are fragile, relatively, and spend more time off the road than mid-range workhorses.
I'd love to buy a reliable premium/luxury car - for what I'd get out of driving it, not for what others thought of me!
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It does seem like that, RT, doesn't it - yet I can never work out why an Audi should be any less reliable than a mechanically identical Skoda. I suspect that there are higher expectations of prfemium brands.
Chris 79 - many thanks for your reply to me upthread. I'm in a similar position in that I've been changing cars every 2-3 years but (in my case because of impending retirement) will probably buy one and keep it for longer. I'm tempted by the Q3 because it can come with the lovely TSI petrol engine as in my Octavia vRS: the biggest petrol engine in the cheaper Yeti is a 1.8. I'm not anti-diesel but after five diesel cars in a row I love the comparative refinement of the petrol Octavia.
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The majority are well aware of this. I imagine most of those that drive the German brands are aware of this also. But the 'premium badge' is a must for some people.
It's fair enough I suppose, we all have different priorities
Plus, they don't care as they are often driving company cars anyway.
Confession time. I drive an Audi. It's certainly not perfect - but it's a nice product and I'd hesitate to brand it as overrated.
I know a number of Audi drivers and most of them are "normal" - just like the drivers of any other brand. Some of these hold managerial positions and are the kind of folk that you wouldn't mind working for.
As for the others (a very small but highly visible minority) these are the steretypical ones who give Audi a bad name. Without exception they are all pushy managers/sales people who you would NOT like to work for!
Pushy people seem (I stress "seem") to be even more so when they get behind the wheel of a car.
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There's a lot of stereotyping going on in this thread, isn't there!
You don't buy a 90 bhp Octavia and expcect it to be fun to drive: it's a workhorse, and a good one.
Avant, I can see where you are coming from, but there is really no reason why the Octavia 90 bhp couldn't have been fun to drive. My present 88 bhp diesel estate is fun to drive, being very much e driver experience focussed car
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Out of interest what car is it. I'm interested to know what low powered diesel is a fun car to drive. I ask as I commute in a 95 hp diesel corsa. It ticks many boxes (economical, comfortable , well equipped ) however fun to drive it ain't.
If yours is as good as you make out i ll take a look when the corsa goes.
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Depends on your idea of fun - back in the '90s and '00s we had a family Nova, initially for SWMBO to do the school run and then for delinquent son to use - it also doubled as my "backup" when my own car wasn't available.
It only had 60 bhp from it's 1.2 petrol engine and was rather vocal at 70 on the motorway but it was fun to drive in town and country, mainly because it was so nimble.
To be open, I did add anti-roll bars front and back which were perversely omitted from the lowly versions which did make it corner with much less roll than normal.
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My Mk6 petrol Golf GTi with 210 bhp is fun. My Mk2 Golf GTi with 139bhp is most certainly fun. Probably the most fun I've had in a road car. The wife's 123d BMW diesel convertible with 204bhp isn't fun. Swift, yes, but fun? No. The hatch 123d might be better but it isn't a patch on the Mk6 to drive despite only being 6 bhp down.
I'm struggling to put the words "diesel" and "fun" in the same sentence, no matter what people will say when they come along and talk about high powered diesels. Particularly quite a large car with 90 bhp in it. Too heavy, too unwieldy etc. etc. Fun? No chance.
And before anyone asks, I've had several diesels in my time as well as several petrols so I do have plenty of experience of them.
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" The wife's 123d BMW diesel convertible with 204bhp isn't fun. Swift, yes, but fun? No. The hatch 123d might be better but it isn't a patch on the Mk6 to drive despite only being 6 bhp down."
AKR, do you think that's because it's a diesel, or would a petrol 1-series be no better? The only time I've driven a 1-series was when my wife's Mini was being serviced and the courtesy car was a 123d, (surprising up-market for a courtesy car). I rememer it being very fast in a straight kline but nothing special in the handling department. Could that be because of the heavy diesel lump up front?
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Out of interest what car is it. I'm interested to know what low powered diesel is a fun car to drive. I ask as I commute in a 95 hp diesel corsa. It ticks many boxes (economical, comfortable , well equipped ) however fun to drive it ain't. If yours is as good as you make out i ll take a look when the corsa goes.
Chris79, it is a MK1 Focus Estate on a 51 plate. Sharp, direct, accurate steering and it loves going round corners, Gearchange is tight, light and precise. Power delivery is more linear than the Octavia and brisk enough for me, but engine is slightly more vocal. Driving postion is superb, commanding, with pedals well spaced, plenty of space for left foot to rest and thankfully no footrest. Steering wheel is in line with driver. Brakes are better than Octy.
Only real downsides are economy, about 15-20% less than Octavia, ride is not as compliant and it lacks the feeling of solidity. Driving seat comfort is nearly as good, however, the Skoda had the most comfortable seat of any car I have ever owned. Once, only once, I travelled for 300 miles, four hours 15 minutes without a stop and no discomfort at all. The front passenger seat is now my computer chair.:)
I paid peanuts for the car. It had FSH and the second owner had kept every single receipt of work done in the time he owned it. Ex MOD, so it is fitted with a bomb detection device.
I never expected to buy a Focus estate. I found it by chance. TBH I'd been looking for a MK1 Octavia Elegance estate. Unfortunately, I never spotted one within a sensible distance. I'd also looked at 406 estates but sagging seats and rippled flanks put me off. The beauty of the 406 is the delight to drive element and ability to cover huge mileages.
I'd always thought a Passat estate (1998-2004 models) would be perfect for me, so much so I looked at three. I had even taken cash to buy one of them, because the vendor sold it so well via the advert and phone. When I got to see the car he told me a couple of problems he'd conveniently not previously mentioned. BTW, the first one reached a stupid price on ebay and the last one, a PD 130BHP, supposedly had FSH. 60,000 miles of service history was missing. That was a couple of years ago. I ended up with a 1996 W124 Mercedes E300 Diesel estate. I still have it, and love it, even though it can't really be called fun to drive. I've always wanted a W124 estate
In the past I have owned (amongst others) a MK1 Micra 1.0.............good for 600 miles in one day, Alfa Guilia Sprint 101 series, Lancia Fulvia S3 coupe, Frogeye Sprite, MK1 Golf GTI 1600 & 1800, Toyota Corolla GT TwinCam, MX-5 MK1, Morris Minor, original Mini, Citroen Dyane, Renault 4, Peugeot 205, Citroen ZX, MG Metro, 1956 Standard Super 10...........in 1982 for £100, 51,000 miles and just one owner from new. The Standard was my first car.
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