Avensis Petrol 1.8 - Clutch Judder When Used a Lot - KWUK

Hi, I've looked on various forums about this problem that's started on my car, but none of the circumstances are the same as with mine, so hope you can advise specifically. This is my third Avensis in past 8 years, so I know what's normal, and never had previous problems. Had this current Avensis (petrol 1.8) for just under 4 years; it's nearly 5 years old and has done only 37,000 miles (genuine I believe, only one previous owner).


The juddering problem started recently, at first it seemed to be intermittent, but I've now established a clear pattern. Most of the time everything is fine; can do longish runs eg 1-2 hours, motorway trips etc no problem. Stop, engage first gear, let the clutch out as normal - everything fine - until -


If I do trips which are stop-start - eg traffic congestion, driving through city centres, lots of traffic lights, rush hour driving etc, then everything ok for first 20 mins or so of that kind of use. Then first signs of judder arise when letting clutch out starting in first gear. As the stop-start traffic timescale increases, so the judder gets progressively worse. Eventually have to do extra blips of accelerator and balance clutch abnormally to overcome the increasing judder; try to get into second gear as fast as possible. Only occurs in first gear. Following day - back to square 1 - everything seemingly normal. Another long trip is ok. Stop-start traffic ok for first 20+ mins again, then the judder slowly arises again. Tried the checks for clutch slip, does not occur. Tried reverse gear (doesn't seem to judder, even when first has started juddering). Doesn't seem to occur in second gear. Planning to consult with a garage, but thought it's better to seek feedback here first - eg likely cause, possible rectification cost ? Thanks for any advice you can give.

Edited by KWUK on 09/04/2013 at 23:39

Avensis Petrol 1.8 - Clutch Judder When Used a Lot - Oli rag

That's quite a strange one, I wouldn't have thought it was a problem with oil getting on to the clutch, as it wouldn't be as consistant as you say. The fact that it only starts to judder after you've done a lot of stop start driving leads me to think it's related to the temperature of the clutch.

Possibly the heat is affecting the friction plate behaviour or the pressure plate springs. Unfortunately I don't think you're going to find a solution for it other than to remove and inspect the clutch.

Another possibility is a weak or damaged engine or gearbox mount.

Avensis Petrol 1.8 - Clutch Judder When Used a Lot - TeeCee

>> it's nearly 5 years old and has done only 37,000 miles

So previously owned by someone who only used it for short trips, probably around town with lots of gearchanges. Possibly one of the sort who also delights in sitting at lights in gear with the clutch down.

I'd suspect that the clutch cover's "tired" and/or the plate's glazed.

Avensis Petrol 1.8 - Clutch Judder When Used a Lot - Peter.N.

That is an odd one. Clutch judder can happen on diesels as a result of very little clutch use due to the high torque at low revs so the clutch doesn't need to do much work, on a petrol engine I would have thought the more slippage required would keep the clutch in good order.

On diesels it can often be inproved by giving the clutch a bit of a work out, slipping it purposely - but gently. Will the car pull away OK in second gear, if so I would suggest doing that for a bit and see if it improves things.

Avensis Petrol 1.8 - Clutch Judder When Used a Lot - madf

"If I do trips which are stop-start - eg traffic congestion, driving through city centres, lots of traffic lights, rush hour driving etc, then everything ok for first 20 mins or so of that kind of use. Then first signs of judder arise when letting clutch out starting in first gear. As the stop-start traffic timescale increases"

Sounds like:

A heat build up problem affacting an engine of gearbox mounting which softens under heating when in slow moing traffic. First gear gives maximum torque so would place maximum strain on the mountings.

To test: run engine for say 10 miles to warm up and leave over a pit/or on hoist when running and leave for 20 minutes and then try levering all the mountings.. Any casual inspection when the engine is cold and the car not warmed up is likely to find nothing.

OR

gunged up EGR valve which heats up in traffic and jams shut/open .

The easisest to test - and clean is the EGR valve.

Avensis Petrol 1.8 - Clutch Judder When Used a Lot - matt45

my corolla has the same prob should i do the same.ichaged both oils n filters n plugs,thinking it needed a service. sorry for being stupid but were is the egr n what does it do any help please regards

Avensis Petrol 1.8 - Clutch Judder When Used a Lot - AndyH1962

Hi, I've looked on various forums about this problem that's started on my car, but none of the circumstances are the same as with mine, so hope you can advise specifically. This is my third Avensis in past 8 years, so I know what's normal, and never had previous problems. Had this current Avensis (petrol 1.8) for just under 4 years; it's nearly 5 years old and has done only 37,000 miles (genuine I believe, only one previous owner).


The juddering problem started recently, at first it seemed to be intermittent, but I've now established a clear pattern. Most of the time everything is fine; can do longish runs eg 1-2 hours, motorway trips etc no problem. Stop, engage first gear, let the clutch out as normal - everything fine - until -


If I do trips which are stop-start - eg traffic congestion, driving through city centres, lots of traffic lights, rush hour driving etc, then everything ok for first 20 mins or so of that kind of use. Then first signs of judder arise when letting clutch out starting in first gear. As the stop-start traffic timescale increases, so the judder gets progressively worse. Eventually have to do extra blips of accelerator and balance clutch abnormally to overcome the increasing judder; try to get into second gear as fast as possible. Only occurs in first gear. Following day - back to square 1 - everything seemingly normal. Another long trip is ok. Stop-start traffic ok for first 20+ mins again, then the judder slowly arises again. Tried the checks for clutch slip, does not occur. Tried reverse gear (doesn't seem to judder, even when first has started juddering). Doesn't seem to occur in second gear. Planning to consult with a garage, but thought it's better to seek feedback here first - eg likely cause, possible rectification cost ? Thanks for any advice you can give.

Hi,

Did you ever find out what was causing this issue?

My 52 plate Avensis 1.8VVTI suffurs from exactly the same symptoms.

It started about 3-4 years ago and is only really a problem in heavy traffic. I took it into Mr Clutch about 2 years ago after a particullarly bad bout whilst I was on holiday and they could not find any issues.

If the car is moving it does not seem to be a problem

The car is infact now on its 3rd clutch despite having only covered 83,000 miles. The service record shows that the original one was replaced at 13,000 miles! Then replaced again at 36,000. Seems lick it might have been an issue from new.

Never had a car where a cluch has lasted less than 70,000 - 80,000 miles including hot hatches.

The local Toyota Main Dealer (Ipswich) has been useless and unhelpful,

With the common problem with the car drinking oil due to a faulty block and juddering front discs (now on the 6th set!!) and many other problems, I have completely been put off theToyota experience, and will never buy another.

Now thing of having the clutch replaced by Mr Clutch any way just to see if it fixes the issue!

If anyone can shed any light on this issue this would be a massive help.

Thanks

Andy

Avensis Petrol 1.8 - Clutch Judder When Used a Lot - bolt

I`ve come across this problem several times over the years,not just on one make or model but several, it appears to be a problem that can sort itself out over time though not always.

Not sure really what causes it, but have a theory in that it depends on the composition of the clutch friction material, where in some cases the weather affects it,ie in damp wet weather the problem occurs,when its dry its fine

in other words the clutch may not be on its way out,even taking it apart wont always tell you whats wrong, its occured on a few of my cars but never needed replacing,I got used to it eventually

Avensis Petrol 1.8 - Clutch Judder When Used a Lot - gordonbennet
If anyone can shed any light on this issue this would be a massive help.

Andy

It's possible your car was driven badly by its first owner(s) to get through so many clutches and as alluded to by Madf above the problem is from something like engine/box mountings being weakened, either by repetitive racing style starts or riding the clutch on inclines instead of using the parking brake leading to massive heat, or towing, a problem that has never been diagnosed correctly nor fixed, and gets worse as things now warm up.

Mountings often get overlooked, the first W124 MB we bought seemed fine to us, took it into my (then new to us but now used for many years) MB indy for something unrelated, he started the engine and just from the vibration we hadn't noticed on tickover condemned one of the engine mounts without hesitation, sure enough we noticed how much smoother the drive was after that was replaced.

Disc consumption is heavy and again points to driving style, and/or possibly poorly maintained rear brakes leading to the fronts doing all the work, have the disc/pad replacements been with quality parts?

Edited by gordonbennet on 10/11/2014 at 09:44

Avensis Petrol 1.8 - Clutch Judder When Used a Lot - CorollaColourCollection

I'm having exactly the same problem. With the recent drop in temperature and short drives, the cold weather has had me fooled, thinking the clutch judder had dissappeared. Then today, with more driving and getting the car warm, the judder has now returned. My Corolla is a 2006 1.6VVTi. I was happy to see another poster mention engine mounts which is what i have been thinking - they get warm and soften.

The reason I thought of the engine mounts and not a heating clutch, was because it only happens after the car has been at max temp for a while, having me thinking this delay was the time it takes for the heat to travel to the mounts, being a longer distance than the clutch.

I'm at my wits end with it now, which is sad because it is the first Toyota i have ever had. I have to be really skilfull in trying to create a smooth pull away in 1st. One thing i did notice apart from heat was when the car was fully laden with people, it seemed to reduce the judder.

Anyway, maybe together we will eventually solve this problem. Thanks peeps.

Mark.

Avensis Petrol 1.8 - Clutch Judder When Used a Lot - Ebob

Did anybody ever find out what this was.

I have an 2008 1.8 vvti petrol Avensis with the exact same problem.

Intermittent clutch chatter judder when moving off in first.

Bought at 80k now done 94k.

Did it repeatedly during heavy traffic on the motorway on a long journey really bad then didn't do it again for several months. Now it has started again.

Will take it to a garage when I get the chance, I winery if they can diagnose without disassembly by which point may as well get them to chuck a new clutch kit in anyway if it needs by the time labour is paid for.

Avensis Petrol 1.8 - Clutch Judder When Used a Lot - Big John

Just in case - check the PCV (Positive Crankcase Ventilation) valve. These can fail causing crankcase pressure that blows oil past seals - this includes the rear crankshaft oil seal that can cause clutch oil contamination / judder and/or past inlet/exhaust valve seals which can cause increase in oil consumption. It's an easy fix as well!

Edited by Big John on 26/11/2017 at 11:28

 

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