Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - Sulphur Man

We have a good neighbours on both sides, actually one is completely great. He's a decorator and interiors man by trade, and a very sought after one, because he's very good.

Anyway he's just bought his partner a car, a 13-reg Skoda Fabia vRS, the one with the petrol 1.4 turbocharged & supercharged TSi, mated to the 7-speed DSG (there was no manual option)

He's delighted, but he doesnt read HJ, and is unaware that this car has a drive train comprising two of VAGs most troublesome pieces of engineering ever, both no longer in production. I havent even hinted that he might be in for a lot of trouble, as he loves the car right now (lime green, black roof, white wheels - it does look good I admit).

Bafflingly, he says he did his homework until the right one came along. Either he read the various forums filled with grief of excess oil consumption and other major problems, or he didnt, or he doesnt think its significant.

There's the possibility that this is a good 'un of course, which I so so hope is the case.

Why the hell didnt he ask me first?? - never mentioned it once. It replaces a Mazda2 1.3 Tamura, which was utterly reliable.....

Everytime I see it arrive and leave, I'll be watching for blue smoke and listening for tinkly engine noise. Im going to suggest monthly oil checks to him, and 98RON fuel, anything to stave off the threat without making him as nervous as me!

Never felt nervous about a car I dont actually own....

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - Avant

As it's coming up for 4 years old, there's a sporting chance that one or both troublesome areas have already gone wrong and been repaired.

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - gordonbennet

To stay good neighbours i'd stay absolutely silent about the possibilities here which you are sensibly doing, if comment is invited i'd make sure its positive only, and if it goes wrong offer soothing sympathies and no advice whatsoever how to deal with it, knowing nothing works in your favour when blame is being thrown about should the smelly stuff hit the fan.

The problem with research is that is has to be from all angles, the usual car magazines can't praise certain makes enough, very few will, HJ like, offer warnings or list regular faults or give a cautious opinion about a car unless it's the current in (or out) joke make of the time, such as Leyland/Rover products once out of favour or Skoda before a certain maker took them over.

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - SLO76
Don't say a word! It's too late he's already bought it and he won't appreciate being told he's potentially bought a pup, especially after telling you a lot of nonsense about having done his homework... he clearly hasn't.

I've been buying and selling motors as a salesman for a major dealer and latterly as a home trader for over 20 years. I've bought and sold thousands of cars over the years and yet few of my friends will ask my opinions on motors they're looking at before they've paid the money and fewer still appreciate me telling the downsides after the deed is done.

Everyone thinks they're an expert and few have even the slightest clue what they're doing. Bugs the life out of me when my frequent Facebook posts asking anyone who's looking at a car to speak to me first. I offer free advice and I'll view any local car for them for free if they have a trade in I'd be interested in buying.

They will always walk away with more for their trade in than the dealer will offer (if it's 7yrs or older) and I'll help then negotiate a discount and advise on the best place to find cheap finance and I'll check over their potential purchase. All I ask is the opportunity to buy their old car which the large dealer will offer buttons for yet few take me up on the offer. Drives me nuts when they later tell me all about their new motor and how they overpaid for it or how their used purchase is lying in bits on the dealers ramps.

Sometimes you just can't help people...

Edited by SLO76 on 12/02/2017 at 23:40

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - oldroverboy.
Don't say a word! It's too late he's already bought it and he won't appreciate being told he's potentially bought a pup, especially after telling you a lot of nonsense about having done his homework...
I'll check over their potential purchase. All I ask is the opportunity to buy their old car which the large dealer will offer buttons for yet few take me up on the offer. Drives me nuts when they later tell me all about their new motor and how they overpaid for it or how their used purchase is lying in bits on the dealers ramps.

Sometimes you just can't help people...

"DITTO"

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - Ebob

I am looking at getting a used car ATM but the thing is pretty much every car seems to have it's troubles or potentially extortionate repairs.

Obviously it's good to look out for common faults but bearing in mind people generally go on a forum when they have a problem and there are tens of thousands of cars sold.

On this forum you'd be made to think that if you buy a diesel you'll end up with the entire car falling apart around you with you left sitting on the seat in the middle of the road holding the steering wheel which isn't attached to anything anymore!

Everybody I know pretty much drives a diesel but I've only ever heard the woes on here!

It would be interesting in a year's time to repost how your neighbours car has been!

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - Sulphur Man

I'll update this thread if anything 'unexpected' happens.....

I can understand how reading HJ as a potential buyer can feel like a barrage of woe. In the case of this particular model, the fact that this engine, and the DSG box bolted to it, were on sale for approximately 5 years tells its own story. Reliable drivetrains should hang around for at least 2 model generations, often more, eg. Honda 1.8 i-VTEC, Merc 2.1 CDI, Ford-Yamaha 1.25 petrol.

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - RobJP

Someone we know is currently looking at changing her car. She does a fair bit of paperwork and admin for farms, along with livestock counts, etc. , so regularly has to drive on rough unmade tracks and across fields. Only does 6-8k miles per annum.

So, she asked my advice. She wants a good-sized estate car, she knows she needs AWD and a somewhat 'jacked-up' chassis, and not bothered about a manual or auto gearbox. Budget is £10k or so. In her own words "I've been and looked at a Volvo XC60 diesel" ...

So I explained to her about modern diesels and DPFs, and that her driving type and annual mileage, along with the price she's buying for, mean that a diesel is most likely expensive problems in short order.

Then we popped onto here, and I went through the 'What's good/bad' section.

After she'd had her eyes opened by that, she asked what I'd suggest. My reply was to go for a Subaru Forester, petrol and manual box. Or a Toyota Rav-4, again with petrol and manual box.

Her response to that was that her dad 'had problems' with a Subaru in the past, so she didn't view them as reliable.

So I asked her what problems he'd had. The answer was that the clutch had failed whilst leaving the Royal Welsh show one year in muddy conditions. At the time the car was about 10 years old and had about 100k on the clock. I pointed out that a clutch that's done that much work is at the end of life, and not 'breaking down'. A shrug of the shoulders in return

-----------------------

She phoned up yesterday. Been to look at a 2011 Tiguan. Diesel, DSG. Really likes it.

There's no helping some people ...

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - gordonbennet
She phoned up yesterday. Been to look at a 2011 Tiguan. Diesel, DSG. Really likes it.

There's no helping some people ...

I've given up completely offering any sort of advice now to people i know, for some bewildering reason even if they've completely ignored you for some reason you're still in the frame when the thing they bought (the very opposite fo your suggestion) expires.

Following my return to Landcruisers one chap in particular at work is expressing interest in similar, youngish foreign fellow (nice enough chap) with a young family but he has no concept of mechanics, i'm not encouraging him because these like so many cars need careful research and sifting through to find the good ones which are very expensive, and if he bought a good one he hasn't any idea the amount of good care such a vehicle needs for a long life, fortunately he thinks the more modern a vehicle the better and after 06 its £500 ved so that should scupper such plans anyway, i'm dreading if he gets one because i'm somehow going to be held partly responsible for problem yet i've gone out of my way to warn about the pitfalls.

For the record Rob, your Subaru suggestion is perfect for that use, and i'd hazard a guess that the clutch wearing on dad's Scooby had been giving clues as to its demise for some time before it failed.

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - gordonbennet

Reliable drivetrains should hang around for at least 2 model generations, often more, eg. Honda 1.8 i-VTEC, Merc 2.1 CDI, Ford-Yamaha 1.25 petrol.

Thats a very good point, gradually refining something that was basically sound, instead of a completely new design that proves to have flaws which then gets quietly dropped and replaced with another rapid fill in?

Are we doom and gloom merchants here about Diesels, well yes possibly and there are many posts here suggesting to avoid Diesel completely to which i don't always agree but its a minefield out there, there's probably enough knowledge here to tell mr average car buyer which ones to avoid and which years, eg standard 1.9pd fine in 110/130 but 150 possibly best avoided.

I tend to the middle of the road camp, that is that not all Diesels are doom and gloom, but that if you are buying or keeping long out of warranty then careful choice should be made to avoid DPF's if possible (unless your use is suitable) and to buy vehicles which had sensible service histories, taking extra care to avoid those which have been maintained only in accordance with some makers rather minimal requirements that are probably not going to lead to a long trouble free life.

Using ones noddle as regarding looking after your car helps, if some think of cars as white goods that only get looked at when they pack up or assume the MOT test to be a service, or top the oil up when the oil light comes on whilst driving, then maybe simple NA petrol engines are the sensible choice.

How exactly do you convey years of gained knowledge in answering a request on the forum from someone who plainly or admittedly hasn't the foggiest idea about cars, hence the many KISS posts here.

It's not nice to read about people who arn't wealthy buying into out of warranty DPF's EPB's DSG's EGR's or other avoidable 'benefits' with their hard earned money and finding four figure repair bills looming when just one of these ticking time bombs blows, hene the many keep it simple or keep it well known as durable answers here.

Edited by gordonbennet on 13/02/2017 at 09:50

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - kiss (keep it simple)

Most people buy a car from the heart, not the head.

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - gordonbennet

Most people buy a car from the heart, not the head.

Yes often too rapidly then repent at leisure.

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - corax

Most people buy a car from the heart, not the head.

Most people (in the UK) buy a car from the heart, not the head.

It's German so it must be reliable innit?

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - Wackyracer

This thread is very interesting in that a neighbour has unexpected bought a Ford Focus with 1.0T Ecoboom engine in much the same way. She didn't even mention buying a new car then went out and bought it as a spur of the moment thing.

Like has been said, family and friends won't listen anyway so there is little you can do to influence them in the right direction. I dare not tell her it's likely to end in a bad way.

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - brum

On a positive note, not everyone with the cars/engine mentioned will have a problem. Probably less than 10%. I suppose it depends on how long they keep it, how well they maintain them and how good their dealer is.

Best not to get involved, as you will often be tasked with sorting out their problems for them.

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - glidermania

Sorry I have to smile a little bit at these doom and gloom threads. There's a good chance the guy wont have problems with the car, it is only a small minority that do have problems and I think a lot of them are very picky at best.

If the car is well maintained, serviced correct and driven correctly, it'll probably never experience the problems a small number of people unfortunately have. Does anyone have a car that doesnt have some issue according to other drivers of the same make?

You really only have to read some of the good \ bad comments about cars in the review comments here to realise how utterly picky some people are. Ive had Alfasud, BMW 3 series and Z4, Vauxhall Astra and Zafira A and Renault Espace and Twingo from new and usually owned for 7 or 8 years before being moved on. Ive never had the issues some people have said theyve had.

I cant be that lucky!

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - Avant

Not lucky, Heliboy - the key to your post is that you bought from new, and we'll assume that you're a considerate driver and have your cars regularly serviced.

I've been lucky enough to have had new cars for the past 45 years. We stayed in the same house for 40 of those years, albeit with an extension - all of which may not have made absolute financial sense, but as a high-mileage motorist I was buying peace of mind.

Clearly not everyone can do this, and all one can do when buying used is to minimise the risk (you can never eliminate risk), by, for example, ensuring the car has a full service history and gives the impression of having been looked after; and buying a brand which is known to stand up better to abuse and neglect, such as something Japanese/Korean and petrol-powered.

Of course there are plenty of good used diesels / French cars / cars with dual-clutch transmission. It's just that the risk of a bad one is that much greater. Let's hope that the OP's neighbour is one of the lucky ones.

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - Deft

It's definitely useful to know about above average troublesome engines or gearboxes etc., but I'd be interested in the real risk increase above average reliability. Reading HJ does definitely put me off certain things. Genuine failure rates can't be ridiculously high in reality?

This is kind of why if buying new (and outright) I'd stick with local main dealer for purchase and servicing as then you know who to sue when it all goes wrong.

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - davecooper

Just for info, the VAG group tfsi engine does not have a supercharger, just a turbo. The S stands for "Stratified" and is the method whereby the fuel is injected into these engines.

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - Avant

They don't now, but there was a short-lived run of engines that had both, including, I think, the Fabia where this thread started.

Thanks for the info about what S stands for. 'Turbo Stratified Injection' - that must be what my Octavia vRSs were. SWMBO's Audi A1 is TFSI....perhaps we won't speculate on what the F stands for, unless someone knows.

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - skidpan

They don't now, but there was a short-lived run of engines that had both, including, I think, the Fabia where this thread started.

The supercharged/turbocharged engines were all based on the old chain cam TSi engines. I think that the last VAG model to use the dual charge set up was the 1.4 TSi 160 PS Tiguan that has recently been replaced by the new model range.

The major number of issues with these dual charge units has been caused by the laptop and shed brigade who find that with a little knowledge they can achieve stupid power levels with nothing nore than few lines of code. Unfortunately the engines were probably close to their reliability limit as standard and the addition of another 100 bhp with no strenghtening, lubrication or cooling mods was too much to stand. The 7 speed DSG has a torque limit of 250 NM (plus a safety factor) and after mods the engines produce way over this figure. (VAG limit all cars using the 7 speed DSG to 250 NM which is why the 1.8 TSi in the Leon has exactly the same max torque as the 1.4 TSi). On the various VAG forums the owners were more than happy to boast about the stupid power increases and show video clips of their sub 5 second 0 - 60 times and when challanged about the likelihood of future issues caused by such harsh treatment would simply comment it was not thier issue since the car would be handed back after 3 years for the next owner to sort. And its that next owner that comes on here blaming VAG and not the muppet who ragged the car into an early grave.

In truth I think the dual charge unit fared better in the Tiguan than other models simply because it did not attract idiots.

SWMBO's Audi A1 is TFSI....perhaps we won't speculate on what the F stands for, unless someone knows.

Audi do not want buyers to think that they are getting the same engine in their upmarket hatch as the buyer of a Skoda Fabia so they simply added the "F" in the badge. I was told it stood for "fuel".

Our new neighbours son has an A1, a 1.2 TFSi. He remarked on our Seat a few weeks ago being a TSi and I said simply, "yes , the same engine as your Audi only the bigger more powerful 1.4". He went crazy saying that Audi make their own engines which are absolutely nothing to do with other VAG companies. Apparantly they are much higher quality being made of superior materials nad assembled by a hand picked group of superhumans. He refuses to even look in my direction now, total muppet.

Can you imagine the headlines in the Daily Mail, "Shock, Horror, buyers discover their Audi 's use the same engines as Skoda's.

In fact all the 1.4 TSi engines are made at the Skoda plant (probably the 1.2's as well since they share many components) and distributed to the various assemply plants around Europe.

New Daily Mail headline "Shock, Horror, Audi use engines made by Skoda"

Edited by skidpan on 15/02/2017 at 14:35

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - RobJP

Oh, you think you jest about the headline ...

www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/caradvice/honestjohn/...l

Surprising the Daily Fail haven't run a 'campaign' on it as yet. But give them time.

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - skidpan

Honest John missed an opportunity there to redicule an idiot. He should have advised he employ a mega expensive lawyer and sue VAG.

But it proves my assumption correct that both the 1.2 and 1.4 were built by Skoda.

Edited by skidpan on 15/02/2017 at 14:59

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - csgmart

The 7 speed DSG has a torque limit of 250 NM (plus a safety factor) and after mods the engines produce way over this figure. (VAG limit all cars using the 7 speed DSG to 250 NM which is why the 1.8 TSi in the Leon has exactly the same max torque as the 1.4 TSi).

Interesting - the New Golf R (2017) has close to 300nm of torque and has now adopted a 7 spped DSG over the previous 6 speed. Is this box different from other 7 speed boxes?

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - skidpan

Interesting - the New Golf R (2017) has close to 300nm of torque and has now adopted a 7 spped DSG over the previous 6 speed. Is this box different from other 7 speed boxes?

Yup. Its a new box. Think its the same used in the Audi TT.

But the new Golf R has got 280 lbsft of torque which is 380 NM, way more than the 300 NM you quote. The new GTi has 350 NM but still uses a 6 speed DSG.

New Daily Mail headline "Shock, Horror, VW use Audi gearbox".

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - csgmart

Interesting - the New Golf R (2017) has close to 300nm of torque and has now adopted a 7 spped DSG over the previous 6 speed. Is this box different from other 7 speed boxes?

Yup. Its a new box. Think its the same used in the Audi TT.

But the new Golf R has got 280 lbsft of torque which is 380 NM, way more than the 300 NM you quote. The new GTi has 350 NM but still uses a 6 speed DSG.

New Daily Mail headline "Shock, Horror, VW use Audi gearbox".

You are correct - I confused lbsft with nm....

I hear it's a better box than the 6 speed - have you any thoughts?

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - skidpan

I hear it's a better box than the 6 speed - have you any thoughts?

Having driven 3 Skodas fitted with DSG's (2 7 speed + 1 6 speed) and a VW fitted with the 6 speed I can assure you that I hate them all equally.

All auto's are horrid and despite all the fine words the DSG is no better.

I would spend neither my own or anyone elses money on one.

Any car that is sold with no manual option is immediately struck off my list. Having had 2 Golf GTi's in the past I still long to buy another but as far as I am aware its DSG only so no more GTI's for me.

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - csgmart

Having driven 3 Skodas fitted with DSG's (2 7 speed + 1 6 speed) and a VW fitted with the 6 speed I can assure you that I hate them all equally.

All auto's are horrid and despite all the fine words the DSG is no better.

I would spend neither my own or anyone elses money on one.

Any car that is sold with no manual option is immediately struck off my list. Having had 2 Golf GTi's in the past I still long to buy another but as far as I am aware its DSG only so no more GTI's for me.

Fair do's. I prefer autos and we've got an old shape Tiguan (end of 2015 model) which we really like and the DSG box on it is fantastic. It's on a PCP so it goes back when that ends.

The Golf R does come as a manual - not sure on the GTi.

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - nick62

I have a VW commercial which has a produces 400Nm of torque and has a 7 speed DSG gearbox.

Although I don't do stellar annual mileages, 99% of my trips are at least 100 miles or more and normally 200+ miles.

After never having had an "automatic" before (I'm not going to get into arguments about "proper" auto's, etc.,) I find it an extremely pleasant vehicle to drive, and question why I have never had an auto before!

I understood before buying that a gearbox oil change is required at 40,000 miles, (so what)!

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - brum

As someone who follows briskoda, can i put a couple of facts straight about the fabia vrs mk ii, on which some previous posters are plain wrong.

The engine fitted is the CAVE and in later revision the CTHE vag engine. Both of these are indeed twin charger engines, using both a roots supercharger and a turbocharger.

The CAVE variant has a very high incidence of extremely high oil consumption (one litre in less than 1000 miles) and very fast spark plug errosion/failure (effecting mainly no.1 cylinder iirc) irregardless of state of tune or maintenance, with a high number affected from new and during the 3 year warranty period.

Many standard unmodified cars, religously and meticulously serviced, suffer terminal engine failure over a widespread span of tenure/mileage. It is not a problem confined to modified cars.

Even today, VAG do not know the root cause of the problem and have tried many quick fixes that simply do not work.

Furthermore Skoda has stuck rigorously to the VAG rule that oil consumption of less than 0.5 liters of oil per 1000 km is accepable and is not a reason to do anything. Customers querying their engines appetite for oil are charged around £75 to carry out a consumption test, non refundable if their ridiculous criterea is not met.

Skoda have changed many engines both under warranty and out of warranty but in most cases its been a tough battle for the customer to win. In many cases the replacement engine also failed. One guy has had 3 replacement engines.

The newer CTHE is better but still has oil consumption problems and a high failure rate.

A lot of the problem I feel lies in the dealer network who in my experience are apt at fobbing the customer off and will fib readily to get rid of a customer or rip them off denying them goodwill they are entitled to.

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - nick62

Ditto on your last paragraph

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - skidpan

and will fib readily to get rid of a customer or rip them off denying them goodwill they are entitled to

Once the warranty has ended no one is automatically entitled to goodwill. Its at the discretion of the manufacturer and unless the dealer allerts them about any customer issues they will never find out.

In almost 40 years of buying new cars we have had dealers submit goodwill claims on our behalf 3 times and each time without having to request they do it. In fact the VW dealer specifically asked if we would like them to submit a claim.

The first was the alternator on a Ford Escort that failed 3 months after the warranty ended, we got about 50% contribution.

The second was the waterpump on a VW Golf 7 months after the warranty ended. Got 100% back.

3rd was a faulty clutch on a Golf about 2 months out of warranty. Car was still drivable but sometimes it was impossible to engage gears with the car at rest. Got 100% back.

So more than happy with VW's treatment.

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - brum

Once the warranty has ended no one is automatically entitled to goodwill. Its at the discretion of the manufacturer and unless the dealer allerts them about any customer issues they will never find out.

Not strictly true. Call it what you will, but in current uk law, all new products sold need to be of an "adequate quality" and that holds for up to six years. Of course you have to be prepared to seek a legal judgement in every case, but if an engine has problems from day one and dies irreparably in year 4 despite moderate mileage and proper servicing and there is a documented history of many others doing so indicating a quality or design issue then I suspect a judge will support the view that the car left the factory with those issues.

Skoda have a formula for goodwill, biased on your dealer servicing record, that extends to 5 or 6 years. My experience shows that often the block is simply down to the dealer as Skoda often insists the dealer chips in.

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - bazza

Well Brum, you have squashed any ideas I ever had of risking one of the newer VAG petrols, especially as I hang on to my cars a good while outside warranty. I've had Octavia 1.9 diesels for 14 years and am deliberating on what's next, I was starting to think about risking a 1.4 tsi but it sounds as if VAG are still not there in terms of reliability yet. I had thought the newer belt drive models were looking good, but your post indicates still a number of problems. My expectation would be for an engine to run to 150K with no major issues, given careful ownership. Is this too much to ask?

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - brum

My comments about the 1.4 vrs engines only apply to the high power twin charger engines of that era. Vw no longer make twin charger engines, theyve learnt their lesson. The latest 1.4 tsi with cambelt drive is a fine engine completely different design with no known weaknesses at this moment in time. I think its probably the best engine they've got.

Edited by brum on 16/02/2017 at 10:54

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - Avant

The Golf GTI does indeed come as a manual as well as DSG: I believe it's the Golf R estate that you can only have as DSG, for reasons known only to VW.

The issue with DSG is not so much the number of speeds as the type of clutch. Don't ask me to explain the difference, but it appears that the problems have mostly been with the dry clutch. These are exclusively 7-speed, but I beileve that there are wet-clutch DSGs with 6 or 7 speeds.

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - csgmart

The issue with DSG is not so much the number of speeds as the type of clutch. Don't ask me to explain the difference, but it appears that the problems have mostly been with the dry clutch. These are exclusively 7-speed, but I beileve that there are wet-clutch DSGs with 6 or 7 speeds.

Do you know what gearbox type the new Golf R has (wet or dry)?

Skoda Fabia vRS - My neighbour has taken an unwitting risk - notagoodname
Think of all the mechanics, parts companies, delivery drivers etc etc dependent on people making bad car choices. Like the criminal justice system - from judge to prison officer there is an on-going need for people to continue making bad decisions. Ditto health.



 

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