Nissan Sweetener - Who is next in the queue for Government Assistance - Steveieb

Was Mrs May caught off balance by the shrewd approach by Carlos Ghosn early after she took over as PM.

Now I suspect she will have a queue at the door from all the other manufacturers requesting special assistance or consider leaving the UK

Nissan Sweetener - Who is next in the queue for Government Assistance - Bromptonaut

As Remain pointed out throughout the referendum campaign Brexit would lose our massive advantage as a Nation on the EU who's first language was that of business.

Nissan Sweetener - Who is next in the queue for Government Assistance - SLO76
Business dislikes instability, it's perfectly reasonable they would seek reassurances against the political and economic upheaval that will come from leaving.

As a tax payer I would far rather act as guarantor against the possibility of tariffs being implemented rather than losing the investment and jobs these firms bring. Any tariffs would be countered by our own which would more than cover the cost of subsidising our own exports.

However I believe fully we'll end up with a similar deal to Norway with free market access that requires a near full contribution to EU funds and acceptance of free movement but we'll no longer have any say over EU policy. As I argued during the build up to the vote it's almost guaranteed we'll still retain all the negatives but lose all control over it. The one big benefit we will gain however that will make a difference will be power over welfare which can be used to deter the feckless idle from turning up uninvited.

Nissan Sweetener - Who is next in the queue for Government Assistance - RT
Business dislikes instability, it's perfectly reasonable they would seek reassurances against the political and economic upheaval that will come from leaving. As a tax payer I would far rather act as guarantor against the possibility of tariffs being implemented rather than losing the investment and jobs these firms bring. Any tariffs would be countered by our own which would more than cover the cost of subsidising our own exports. However I believe fully we'll end up with a similar deal to Norway with free market access that requires a near full contribution to EU funds and acceptance of free movement but we'll no longer have any say over EU policy. As I argued during the build up to the vote it's almost guaranteed we'll still retain all the negatives but lose all control over it. The one big benefit we will gain however that will make a difference will be power over welfare which can be used to deter the feckless idle from turning up uninvited.

I don't see that scenario occuring, regardless of it's support - those who voted Leave would see that as remaining.

The concept of a soft Brexit is a non-starter - it's in or out, nothing in between.

Nissan Sweetener - Who is next in the queue for Government Assistance - bolt

but we'll no longer have any say over EU policy

Sorry, but did we have any anyway, I thought it was just a dictatorship. do as we say or else? correct me if wrong

Nissan Sweetener - Who is next in the queue for Government Assistance - SLO76

but we'll no longer have any say over EU policy

Sorry, but did we have any anyway, I thought it was just a dictatorship. do as we say or else? correct me if wrong

You are wrong... Official EU voting records* show that the British government has voted ‘No’ to laws passed at EU level on 56 occasions, abstained 70 times, and voted ‘Yes’ 2,466 times since 1999. In other words, UK ministers were on the “winning side” 95% of the time, abstained 3% of the time, and were on the losing side 2%. This is counting votes in the EU Council of Ministers, which passes most EU laws jointly with the European Parliament.

Edited by SLO76 on 31/12/2016 at 22:16

Nissan Sweetener - Who is next in the queue for Government Assistance - gordonbennet

Last time i looked we bought far far more from than we sold to the EU, which to put it in a nutshell makes us the customer, and there's always someone else wants to woo customers, so no reason at all for us to be paying any dues to be in this cosy little club, and open borders are a no no, anyone who hasn't noticed whats happening over the other side of the moat re security with the usual suspects had better wake up a bit sharpish.

Interesting times ahead, now do the govt of the day do what they wanted all along and risk a soft Brexit, which actually isn't a Brexit at all (EU have form for rebranding treaties and forcing countries to vote again till they give the right answer), or do they do as they were bidden by the majority who voted.

Be careful Ms May, those 17 million might not be forgiving at the next general election if you welch on this, the broken (again) solemn promise that Cameron-the-Vanished made to carry out the will of the people.

Truly interesting times, made far more so with the effects of the ripples from the large rock thrown in the pond from the other side to coe ashore here with the election of Trump.

Roll on 2017, may there be more electoral shocks to come as the previously silent majorities finally say enough.

LePen voted in and Merkel booted out would be a good start.

Edited by gordonbennet on 31/12/2016 at 21:15

Nissan Sweetener - Who is next in the queue for Government Assistance - SLO76
"Last time i looked we bought far far more from than we sold to the EU, which to put it in a nutshell makes us the customer, and there's always someone else wants to woo customers, so no reason at all for us to be paying any dues to be in this cosy little club,"

The US buys more from the EU than we do yet their exporters still have to pay tariffs. Currently US car manufacturers have to pay 10% in tariffs to export into the EU.
Nissan Sweetener - Who is next in the queue for Government Assistance - gordonbennet
The US buys more from the EU than we do yet their exporters still have to pay tariffs. Currently US car manufacturers have to pay 10% in tariffs to export into the EU.

Watch this space, the days of the US shooting itself in the foot are going to come to a very abrupt end once the current regime have finished spitting their dummies out and cleared off to plot from without the White house.

Nissan Sweetener - Who is next in the queue for Government Assistance - SLO76
"Watch this space, the days of the US shooting itself in the foot are going to come to a very abrupt end once the current regime have finished spitting their dummies out and cleared off to plot from without the White house."

Short of war and regime change they can't force the EU to do what Trump wishes. No denying though it's going to be an interesting 4 years...
Nissan Sweetener - Who is next in the queue for Government Assistance - SLO76
Don't get me wrong here, I'm no fan of the EU as it is but I believed staying and fighting for reform was the best option. Despite what the Brexit campaign suggested the pro business pro common sense right of centre were gaining traction in Europe after years of mismanagement by the left. Sadly now that will be reduced when the centralist UK leaves.
Nissan Sweetener - Who is next in the queue for Government Assistance - Engineer Andy
Don't get me wrong here, I'm no fan of the EU as it is but I believed staying and fighting for reform was the best option. Despite what the Brexit campaign suggested the pro business pro common sense right of centre were gaining traction in Europe after years of mismanagement by the left. Sadly now that will be reduced when the centralist UK leaves.

Sorry, but I think you're completely wrong there:

We've been, as you've said, 'fighting' for 'change' in the EU for the last 30 odd years with little to show for it - unlike many people in the 1970s who voted to join/stay in the former 'Common Market', it always was a political institution, naively set up to circumvent the will of the peoples of Europe so that they never had the power to vote in another facist dictator. The EU/Commission bigwigs hence don't want political control to be 'of the people' as they don't trust them (and never did) in the first place.

Your contention that the 'pro-business/common sense right-of-centre arguments have gained ground in mainland Europe is also false, IMO. The vast majority of the political gains have been made by the far right and left, as has been seen in Greece, many other Mediterranean countries and now richer nations such as France, Germany and Holland, plus hardline governments or significant political groups in Eastern EU countries such as Poland and Bulgaria. Many hardline elements on the far left/right political wings still play a large part in the former Yugoslavia, where underlying tensions since the civil war still haven't been resolved. As a result, selfish, racist, protectionist and anti-capitalist behavior is on the rise again, just like 100 years ago.

The main problem for the so-called 'centrist politicians' and political parties is that they've forgotten that:

a) they work for their voters, and do not 'rule', and serve at their pleasure. Voters are now fed up with wasteful, incompetent weasels running governments who are more interested in the trappings of power (as well as power iteself) and who wouldn't know how to run a bath, let alone a large organisation/institution (most have little/no worthwhile experience in the real world and get there by patronage or sycophancy);

b) voters want actual 'good (common sense) ideas', not short-term 'initiatives' and 'crack-downs' that accomplish very little (if anything, often manking the long-term situation worse) but cost a fortune. Its precisely because there are so many politicians with no real-word experience (sorry to any BRs who are these, but I would include those in the legal and entertainmennt professions, union reps, middle/upper-ranked public sector managers/civil servants and journalists) who are very good at public speaking but patently have no real knowledge andexperience in the departments/briefs they are supposed to be in charge of, let alone how to be a good quality manager;

c) voters have been telling them for many years they aren't doing a good job and are now only waking up to this fact when the People have reached the end of their tethers and are now voting in much more extreme politicians because, in their eyes (perhaps mistakenly), 'we can't do any worse', and to punish them/give them a good kick in the rear to get them to change (which most are very reluctant to do).

I could spend another hour writing about such failings, but most BRs already know about most of these problems.

To be honest, if (and when) we leave the EU, and especially if any other significant EU nation also does, then the 'Project' in its current form is finished. Perhaps then the politicians of Europe can, after a period of reflection, see sense and start a new organisation from scratch which is a far more loose union, consisting of a free trade/mutual co-operation alliance of free nations - no single currency (yet - that, if all went well so all countries were of similar wealth, would take 100-300 years to achieve), no EU government/commission/parliament and leave everything else to national governments, who would then be incentivised to do a better job as they wouldn't have anyone else to blame but themselves.

Thanks for reading my tome.

Nissan Sweetener - Who is next in the queue for Government Assistance - RT
Don't get me wrong here, I'm no fan of the EU as it is but I believed staying and fighting for reform was the best option. Despite what the Brexit campaign suggested the pro business pro common sense right of centre were gaining traction in Europe after years of mismanagement by the left. Sadly now that will be reduced when the centralist UK leaves.

That was my position when Cameron tried to negotiate reform - if he'd got the necessary reforms I'd have voted Remain. But he didn't ask for enough and got virtually nothing anyway. The other EU states made abundantly clear that we should accept their vision of Europe with no compromise - or get out.

Despite all the doom & gloom, UK plc with thrive on opportunity - if tariffs and the exchange rate encourage Brits to buy more UK-built cars and fewer foreign-made ones, that good for UK plc and the same for every other industry.

Nissan Sweetener - Who is next in the queue for Government Assistance - Engineer Andy

I think this was previously discussed in the BR at the time the news story arose earlier in the year.

Nissan Sweetener - Who is next in the queue for Government Assistance - gordonbennet

An excellent post of yours up the page Engineer Andy, thankyou, all in a nutshell.

 

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