Zafira tourer - New Zafira tourer - no 1.6 diesel

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Tue 6 Sep 2016 12:56
Zafira tourer - New Zafira tourer - no 1.6 diesel - mudhutter
Have been looking at smallish 7 seaters. Really like the Zafira tourer fro a variety of reasons. All the reviews suggest the 1.6 Diesel engine is the pick, and the claimed fuel economy is about 8mpg better than any of the other engines in the range. The 1.6 just made Jeremy clarksons top ten cars of the last year.

They recently released the 2017 version and it looks significantly uglier than the current model and they seem to have pulled the 1.6 engine. Anyone have any idea why they have pulled what I thought was their flagship engine from the Zafira - is there any method behind this madness?
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Tue 6 Sep 2016 13:48
Zafira tourer - New Zafira tourer - no 1.6 diesel - RT

The Zafira is coming to the end of its production run and it's diesel has been implicated in very high NOx emissions, many time the VW cheat levels - it may be they're only selling the legal versions!

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Tue 6 Sep 2016 20:44
Zafira tourer - New Zafira tourer - no 1.6 diesel - TedCrilly

There is a finite number of engines they can make, maybe for financial reasons they are being allocated to other models.

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Fri 9 Sep 2016 23:30
Zafira tourer - New Zafira tourer - no 1.6 diesel - SLO76
As much as I like the Zafira I'd be wary of the 1.6 diesel. I haven't been able to confirm it but I believe this design is sourced from Fiat same as the 1.3, 1.9 and 2.0 units used in other models. Fiat don't have a great track record for longevity regards Diesel engines and I certainly know of many cases of low mileage engine failure and other major mechanical issues on the 1.3 and 1.9 models, though I've not heard too much on the 2.0.

The only diesel Vaixhalls I'd recommend are those using the highly regarded Isuzu 1.7 diesel. These will run to 250k and beyond with ease if looked after and are highly sought after by taxi operators.

Edited by SLO76 on 09/09/2016 at 23:30

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Sat 10 Sep 2016 10:39
Zafira tourer - New Zafira tourer - no 1.6 diesel - RT
As much as I like the Zafira I'd be wary of the 1.6 diesel. I haven't been able to confirm it but I believe this design is sourced from Fiat same as the 1.3, 1.9 and 2.0 units used in other models. Fiat don't have a great track record for longevity regards Diesel engines and I certainly know of many cases of low mileage engine failure and other major mechanical issues on the 1.3 and 1.9 models, though I've not heard too much on the 2.0. The only diesel Vaixhalls I'd recommend are those using the highly regarded Isuzu 1.7 diesel. These will run to 250k and beyond with ease if looked after and are highly sought after by taxi operators.

The old 1.7 diesel was dropped in 2014 - the GM-Fiat Powertrain Alliance ended in 2005 with both companies retaining rights to the engines - GM have been developing those engines independently since then and regard the new 1.6 Whisper diesel as all-new although it's DNA can be traced back to the JTD - the 2.0 diesel is of course a GM-updated version of the 1.9 JTD.

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Sat 10 Sep 2016 13:26
Zafira tourer - New Zafira tourer - no 1.6 diesel - SLO76
As much as I like the Zafira I'd be wary of the 1.6 diesel. I haven't been able to confirm it but I believe this design is sourced from Fiat same as the 1.3, 1.9 and 2.0 units used in other models. Fiat don't have a great track record for longevity regards Diesel engines and I certainly know of many cases of low mileage engine failure and other major mechanical issues on the 1.3 and 1.9 models, though I've not heard too much on the 2.0. The only diesel Vaixhalls I'd recommend are those using the highly regarded Isuzu 1.7 diesel. These will run to 250k and beyond with ease if looked after and are highly sought after by taxi operators.

The old 1.7 diesel was dropped in 2014 - the GM-Fiat Powertrain Alliance ended in 2005 with both companies retaining rights to the engines - GM have been developing those engines independently since then and regard the new 1.6 Whisper diesel as all-new although it's DNA can be traced back to the JTD - the 2.0 diesel is of course a GM-updated version of the 1.9 JTD.

I know the 1.7 diesel was sadly dropped. It was and still is a strong robust unit and far less likely to give trouble than any of the Fiat derived units. As for the new 1.6 being largely GM's own work I'm not so sure. It shares very similar specification, power outputs and an identical cubic capacity with the Fiat unit and it would be cost effective to jointly pay for such considering their ongoing links. Even if they have carried out much independent development work on it I'd still be wary. I've seen enough Vectra's, Zafiras, Corsas and Astras with knackered fiat diesels at depressingly low mileages to warrant recommending one. It'll take time to recover the reputation and I'd certainly rather buy a used previous gen Zafira or Astra with the 1.7 than a new 1.6. Though as a British built car I hope I'm proved wrong in the long run.
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Sat 10 Sep 2016 21:46
Zafira tourer - New Zafira tourer - no 1.6 diesel - TedCrilly

A somewhat amusing observation....

..Despite being a JOINT venture it always seems that Fiat are responsible for all the perceived shortcomings of these engines. Unless of course you happen to be a fan of all things Italian in which case it seems GM are wholely to blame for everything.

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Sat 10 Sep 2016 21:58
Zafira tourer - New Zafira tourer - no 1.6 diesel - daveyK_UK
Just to add some balance,

As a small business owner, I have had a few 1.3 Fiat diesels in Doblos, Fiorinos , Combos and also had a friends who had it in a Qubo and a Astra.

We took all our vans to 80k, no issues at all with the exception of the Combo vans which we took to 105k and 109k, no issues.

I have witnessed and read many 1.3 diesels going up to 200k+ without problems.


Those who have had problems, is it the DPF that kills of the engine in the end aka runs off its own oil if not regenerating properly?
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Sat 10 Sep 2016 22:08
Zafira tourer - New Zafira tourer - no 1.6 diesel - RT

A somewhat amusing observation....

..Despite being a JOINT venture it always seems that Fiat are responsible for all the perceived shortcomings of these engines. Unless of course you happen to be a fan of all things Italian in which case it seems GM are wholely to blame for everything.

GM and Fiat made their existing technologies available to the other during their Alliance - the engines weren't jointly developed, they were used jointly - ie, the Fiat 1.9 JTD found it's way into Opel/Vauxhall/Saab cars.

But it should be highlighted that GM's use of other manufacturers diesel engines has rarely been happy - the Peugeot 2.3 in Carlton, BMW 2.5 in Omega, the Isuzu 3.0 in Vectra-C and VM Motori 2.0 in Cruze and Captiva all gained dire reputations in GM use but highly rated in their manufacturers own models.

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Sun 11 Sep 2016 11:40
Zafira tourer - New Zafira tourer - no 1.6 diesel - TedCrilly

My own view is that these engines are as reliable as the next ones if correctly maintained. The one in Mrs Crillys 9-3 conv has been faultless since the day she bought it 8 years and 75k ago. The real problem here is the negativity some hold for Fiat and its products.

Fiat- Chyrsler are now the 6th largest manufacturer in the world and their products sell in huge numbers in all parts of the world, in some cases in the top three for that country but as soon as one crosses the channel and lands in the uk it becomes poorly engineered and unreliable.

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Sun 11 Sep 2016 14:10
Zafira tourer - New Zafira tourer - no 1.6 diesel - RT

My own view is that these engines are as reliable as the next ones if correctly maintained. The one in Mrs Crillys 9-3 conv has been faultless since the day she bought it 8 years and 75k ago. The real problem here is the negativity some hold for Fiat and its products.

Fiat- Chyrsler are now the 6th largest manufacturer in the world and their products sell in huge numbers in all parts of the world, in some cases in the top three for that country but as soon as one crosses the channel and lands in the uk it becomes poorly engineered and unreliable.

FCA is on the way down in world ranking - and pushed down to 8th if you include Hyundai-Kia and Nissan-Renault as single groups in the way that Fiat-Chrysler are.

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Sun 11 Sep 2016 18:26
Zafira tourer - New Zafira tourer - no 1.6 diesel - SLO76

A somewhat amusing observation....

..Despite being a JOINT venture it always seems that Fiat are responsible for all the perceived shortcomings of these engines. Unless of course you happen to be a fan of all things Italian in which case it seems GM are wholely to blame for everything.

GM and Fiat made their existing technologies available to the other during their Alliance - the engines weren't jointly developed, they were used jointly - ie, the Fiat 1.9 JTD found it's way into Opel/Vauxhall/Saab cars.

But it should be highlighted that GM's use of other manufacturers diesel engines has rarely been happy - the Peugeot 2.3 in Carlton, BMW 2.5 in Omega, the Isuzu 3.0 in Vectra-C and VM Motori 2.0 in Cruze and Captiva all gained dire reputations in GM use but highly rated in their manufacturers own models.

The 2.3d in the Carlton wasn't a Peugeot unit. Not too sure about the normally aspirated 2.3 but the later turbocharged unit was an Isuzu motor and though no ball of fire it would run and run if looked after same as the 1.7 TD in many other models since the Cavalier. Funny they could never get the 3.0 right though. I believe The joint effort with Fiat was nothing more than GM buying the rights to Fiats design.
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