fuel additive - miracle or scam? - bananastand

This sort of thing crops up from time to time and was mentioned in HJ's letters page a few years back. It's a miracle fuel additive that improves consumption and engine life.

It claims to "dissolve water". I'll leave it to the more technically accomplished forum members to comment on that.

www.covalaquasolve.co.uk

fuel additive - miracle or scam? - RT

When you read the "technical" section, it gives the impression of electrolysis without electricity.

If I was ever crazy enough to invent a genuine fuel-saver, I wouldn't bother marketing it retail - I'd just hold a dutch auction among all the big oil companies to sell them the exclusive rights for billions of pounds and let them do with it as they want.

fuel additive - miracle or scam? - Armitage Shanks {p}

Appears only to be used for diesel fuel. I have had cars in the past with in-line water filters to get rid of water in fuel. If it is somehow dissolved in the fuel I am not sure how that is a problem. Many aero engines have used water/methanol injection in the past and the picture ot a Harrier is irrelevant - the aircraft used to improve the engine thust while hovering.

Has any BR member had a car breakdown due to water dissolved in the fuel as opposed to liquid sloshing about in the bottom of the tank? Probably not. It is an "answer" to a non-existent problem IMO.

fuel additive - miracle or scam? - bananastand

They are advertising for self-employed sales reps. I can just imagine walking into a haulage contractor's office and telling them I have come to dissolve their water, and can I have some money please.

fuel additive - miracle or scam? - MrEckerslikefromRamsbottom

And remember that the diesel fuel filter has a little tap at the bottom to allow the release of any water which might accumulate there. All the 'expensive' diesel additives (Wynns, Millers, etc.) are advertised as having the chemistry to prevent problems with water in the fuel.

fuel additive - miracle or scam? - unthrottled

Next time I run a diesel, I'll try draining the water out of the fuel tank!

Most of their 'testing' was done with purposely adulterated diesel fuels. Diesel/water emulsions seem to enjoy a a cyclical research interest.

Of course, since since the amount of free and dissolve water in commercially available diesel is very small, we don't need to worry about stable emulsions.

fuel additive - miracle or scam? - RT

The original Redex, for petrol engines, did help with water/moisture in the petrol as it helped the water to emulsify (don't ask me to explain that) and the resultant mixture was then more likely to pass through the carburettor float chamber and jets and be disposed of in the combusture chamber. This was particularly beneficial in the olden days when fuel tanks were steel and we routinely ran around with half empty tanks so the natural moisture in air in the top half of the tank would condense on the side of the tank in winter and run down unto the fuel and collect at the bottom which was also where the fuel outlet was.

The benefit was disposing of the water, not turning it into some form of energy !

fuel additive - miracle or scam? - Sofa Spud

A small amount of water is a product of combustion of diesel fuel anyway, so the cylinders, pistons, valves, exhaust system and turbocharger are all subjected to superheated steam anyway. If there's a tiny amount of water emulsified in diesel fuel, it will turn to steam during combustion and just be added to the steam created by combustion. That just leaves injector pump and injectors (or unit injectors) to worry about. Does a tiny amount of water in fuel cause any damage to those?

fuel additive - miracle or scam? - Collos25

Redex caused the exhaust to smoke and thats all it did made people think it was cleaning something.

fuel additive - miracle or scam? - madf

When I was a student I ran a Rover 75 (the orihnal one, not the BMW rubbish - with overhead inlet side exhuast valves. I decided to try Redex and emptied some into each bore through the spark plug holes. Unfortunbately I emptied in rather too much.

Started it up and it idled OK so I thought "job done" and drove down the road to the main road which was two miles to the nearest town.

Imagine my surpirse when I looke din my mirror to see the entire road - which was in a small valley - covered in a blue haze. Yes : the Redex had settled in the exhaust and as it heated up.. out in came a blue smoke.

The moke lasted for 1.5 miles just before I got to twon. When I came home 30mins later, it was still there - it was a calm day...

This was NE Scotland which was - and is - very rural...

fuel additive - miracle or scam? - RT

That was standard practice then - pick a day when no neighbours had got washing out, run at engine at 2-3000 rpm and pour the whole bottle of Redex down the carburettor - the resultant smoke screen would have hiden a battleship !

Edited by RT on 24/02/2013 at 20:14

fuel additive - miracle or scam? - Andy P

I've had a look at the safety data sheet,which lists the components, the major ones being:

30-60% Ethoxylated alcohol

30-60% Coco diethanloamide

These are surfactants , so will basically emusifty water in the diesel. Basically they're selling you a concentrated version of what's already in diesel.

What a con...

fuel additive - miracle or scam? - Collos25

What you have to remember is that they will sell many units of the stuff people as a whole are very gullable thats why there are dream shelves in most motor factors full of magic liquids at very expensive prices.Its the same the world over.

fuel additive - miracle or scam? - Ed V

May I add a supplementary?

Is there any point either, in buying more expensive diesel, whatever they call it, rather than Diesel Basics or Essentials?

fuel additive - miracle or scam? - willowwalk

Aquasolve is a compound of non hazardous and biocide free surfactants that works on the density of water causing it to dissolves and migrate the hydroxyl (oxygen and hydrogen, both combustable) to the fuel. If you take the time to look at the real time demo you will see this happen and continue to do so until the water content becomes almost untraceable. It does not go to an emulsion (cloudy and prone to resettling) but goes clear and can remain so for at least 20 years according to samples still available. There is NOTHING else like this available and it is a British invention made in Britain. Oil Companies are aware of it but have no use for it as they refine oil to a certain specification and what happens to it after it leaves the refinery is not their problem, plus why should they be interested in a product that saves fuel consumption? However, bio-fuel producers realise that their product is hydroscopic and attracts water in transit and storage. Aquasolve makes biofuel more usable for longer. Aquasolve will also prevent phase separation of ethanol that will be mixed with carbon fuels and introduced to the UK later this year, as in the US and many other Countires worldwide. You are welcome to air your opinions but do your homework and speak authoratitively before deciding the product is a con. Ask the 1000's of boat owners that use Aquasolve successfully.

fuel additive - miracle or scam? - brum

Aquasolve is a compound of non hazardous and biocide free surfactants that works on the density of water causing it to dissolves and migrate the hydroxyl (oxygen and hydrogen, both combustable) to the fuel.

Wow, I'm baffled by your "scientific" explanation.

Can adding a bit of fairy liquid really make water disappear and turn into burnable fuel?

fuel additive - miracle or scam? - FP

"You are welcome to air your opinions but do your homework and speak authoratitively before deciding the product is a con."

So, WillowWalk, your posting is supposed to speak "authoratitively", is it?

Your product (you are setting yourself up as a spokesperson for this stuff, yes?) consists of "...surfactants that works on the density of water causing it to dissolves and migrate the hydroxyl (oxygen and hydrogen, both combustable) to the fuel."

How can surfactants work on the density of water? The statement makes absolutely no sense.

How do the surfactants cause "the density of water" to dissolve? What on earth does "migrate the hydroxyl (oxygen and hydrogen, both combustable) to the fuel" mean? Again, nonsensical statements.

Oxygen is combustible? Rubbish!

I put it to you that you are a charlatan.

Edited by FP on 18/03/2013 at 20:12

fuel additive - miracle or scam? - brum

OK, having read about surfactants - they reduce surface tension, allowing things that dont normally mix, to mix. So the description of "dissolving" is possibly technically correct. But beyond being mixed evenly in the diesel (as a concentrated squash mixes in water), I dont think there could possibly be a chemical bond between the water and the fuel created, which is what is implied. That requires quite a chemical reaction. The water is just dispersed throughout the fuel instead of seperating out.

Water in diesel fuel is not a problem I've ever had in 40 years driving diesel tractors or cars. (Lots of tractors and older cars did have a drain tap on the fuel filter just in case it was)

It might help in Eastern Europe - there it is known quite a few garages add water to the fuel to bulk it up - maybe they use this product?

fuel additive - miracle or scam? - Avant

I wondered whether to hide Willowwalk's post as being advertising: but I've left it as no-one seriously trying to advertise a product would do so in a single paragraph of such length and tedium that a reader loses the will to live halfway down - long before finding that (s)he can't spell 'authoritative'.

Edited by Avant on 18/03/2013 at 22:59

fuel additive - miracle or scam? - willowwalk
It's your prerogative to hide my post but my comments are not meant to advertise the product at all, in fact I dont care whether you buy it or not, but I know something about it which is more than I can for some of the other contributors. This is such a typical British attitude. It don't sound right so it can't be any good. We are talking about the problems water causes in fuel and the waste caused through diesel bug and contamination which is going to exacerbate with bio fuels, ask any haulage contractor that has had this problem. I am tempted to leave your contributors to continue to contradict themselves but I can see now why it took Dyson so long to become a market leader with his radical technology.
fuel additive - miracle or scam? - unthrottled

why it took Dyson so long to become a market leader with his radical technology.

Do you mean James Dyson and his vacuum cleaner? Dyson is more salesman than engineer, If your vacuum loses suction you need to buy a new bag, not a new hoover. Housewives buy into dual-cyclone 'technology'. hotels don't.
fuel additive - miracle or scam? - Collos25
It's your prerogative to hide my post but my comments are not meant to advertise the product at all, in fact I dont care whether you buy it or not, but I know something about it which is more than I can for some of the other contributors. This is such a typical British attitude. It don't sound right so it can't be any good. We are talking about the problems water causes in fuel and the waste caused through diesel bug and contamination which is going to exacerbate with bio fuels, ask any haulage contractor that has had this problem. I am tempted to leave your contributors to continue to contradict themselves but I can see now why it took Dyson so long to become a market leader with his radical technology.

There was nothing very radical about Dysons technology and it works no better or worse than an old DDR Hover copy, we have both in our house.

fuel additive - miracle or scam? - willowwalk

Interesting to see that attention has now been directed to the validity of Dyson's products and not about the subject matter of water in fuel. Are you fully blown sceptics on all subjects? :-)

Remember if you are not sceptical you are gullable but you should not let doubt cloud belief or proof. I havent seen one adverse report about this product only adverse opinion and that is usually from contributors that are unable to produce any proof or experience. Whereas, conversely, they have over 20 years of technical data to back their claims.

I think I will leave it to forum readers to draw their own conclusions before I get accused of promoting the product, which you notice shall remain nameless.

fuel additive - miracle or scam? - madf

If it was so brilliant fuel makers would use it.

They do not.

Draw your own conclusions.

fuel additive - miracle or scam? - RT

Water in diesel is a big issue, particularly among boaters - it's dealt with cheaply and effectively with a water trap, emptied at appropriate intervals - no snake oil needed.

fuel additive - miracle or scam? - unthrottled

they have over 20 years of technical data to back their claims.

The data provided on the aquasolve website is misconstrued. There was a general interest in creating diesel emulsions in an attempt to reduce emissions. The point was that water was intentionally added to diesel.

Electronic, high-Pressure injection rendered this idea obsolete. So the data is irrelevant.

fuel additive - miracle or scam? - bathtub tom

" I will leave it to forum readers to draw their own conclusions"

That's about the only sensible thing he's written - he assumes correctly.

fuel additive - miracle or scam? - FP

"I havent seen one adverse report about this product only adverse opinion and that is usually from contributors that are unable to produce any proof or experience."

You are being incredibly naive. You haven't seen one adverse report, so the product must be good?

No-one has to produce proof of the negative (that it doesn't work) - it's up to the manufacturers to produce proof that it does.

From the website, the claims are that the product:

Permanently Dissolves water in Carbon, Bio and Aviation Fuels
Reduces Maintenance Costs
Enhances Engine Performance
Reduces Harmful Emissions with Greater Fuel Efficiency
Cleans Filters and Injectors

The proof? Forget the video - it's too easy to mislead people this way; it's worthless as evidence.

Elsewhere on the website there are other pieces of "evidence"; let's take one, that purports to prove improved economy. It is based on tests on ONE vehicle (the document admits the sample is "small" (!) and has been conducted by someone who describes himself thus: "I am Automotive Engineer having passed all qualifications through to Advanced Trades Certificate including extension certificates in LPG and CNG gases. I have 13 years experience in Automotive Engineering including Heavy Transport and Off Shore Oil Exploration and general Automotive work. I am currently completing papers in Management and marketing at The University Of Waikato." Does this inspire confidence?

Another document, produced by London City University, referred to as "Engine Tests with Aquasolve" tests three additives (identified as 6.2, 3.24 and 3.21) which are not explicitly identified as part of the Aquasolve formula. So we don't know what they were testing.

I've spent more than enough time trying to show that it's not even necessary to attempt to prove this stuff doesn't work - there simply isn't any evidence it does.

In any case, commercially available diesel fuel contains additives. I suggest Aquasolve either doesn't work, or at best duplicates what's already there.

Edited by FP on 19/03/2013 at 12:52

fuel additive - miracle or scam? - FP

" I dont care whether you buy it or not, but I know something about it..."

You would be a lot more convincing if you didn't talk scientific twaddle and spout statements that don't make sense, scientifically or otherwise.

fuel additive - miracle or scam? - Andy P

I've never heard that description of how a surfactant works before, and it sounds more like pseudo-science to me.

A surfactant comprises two "parts" - a hydrophobic (oil-loving) part and a hydrophilic (water-living) part. When added to an oil-water mixture, the surfactant orientates itself so the hydrophobic part is in the oil phase and the hydrophilic part is in the water phase. Depending on the concentration of surfactant, you can generate an emulsion (cloudy) or a microemulsion (clear). That is what this product does - it disperses the water within the fuel such that the droplet size is in the nanometre size range. The surfactants themselves contribute nothing to the combustion process.

fuel additive - miracle or scam? - galileo

And the correct term is hygroscopic, not hydroscopic

fuel additive - miracle or scam? - Avant

"I think I will leave it to forum readers to draw their own conclusions before I get accused of promoting the product, which you notice shall remain nameless."

I do beg your pardon, Willowwalk. In my stupidity I got this ridiculous idea into my head that "Aquasolve" - the first word of your first post - was a brand name. What on earth could have made me think that?