Just completed a rather nice M25/M11 run to Stansted. Between the Dartford Tunnel and J27 there were several sets of road works ahead signs but no sign of any work being done (thankfully). I don't know how long they've been there or when the roadworks were completed but I'd have thought it a relatively simple task to remove
these as soon as the work was completed. Thankfully there wasn't much traffic about so it didn't matter all that much but I can't help thinking that phantom road signs like these (and indeed false matrix warning signs) are quite dangerous.
Anyone got any thoughts ?
|
This happen s far too much.
I'm sick of seeing temp speed limits on the dot matrix signs which pertain to roadworks or hold-ups long since gone. We're into the boy-who-cried-wolf territory.
|
|
Yes and I can see why it might take a while to send a man and his dog out to remove surplus signs, cones and sandbags but surely the whole point about matrix signs is that they are operated remotely so why the delay in changing them ??
|
|
|
|
I expect the roadworks warning signs will have been left up for night works or alternatively were in the process of being removed.
Having previously been in charge of design and installation of traffic management schemes on a major road construction projects in London (A12/M11 Link Road) and elsewhere, I have the benefit of experience and can tell you that it is an intensive and costly process removing and replacing TM installations for shift working.
You may often moan and whinge about lane closures etc, but they are ALWAYS there for good reason. Work may not be immediately evident, as it may be off the carriageway or under a bridge deck for example.
Think of the safety of the workforce on the carriageway also. The lane closure is often in place to protect them from YOU.
On the subject of matrix signs, there is currently a very dangerous one between J40 and 39 on M6 southbound - it has been showing ALL 3 LANES CLOSED for the past week - with obvious reaction from driver passing for the first time!!!
|
|
Don't disagree with you LD except to say that IIRC there was no sign of any iminent work being done in the vicinty (ie no materials nearby, no works vehicles, no markings on the road). I have no problem slowing down for roadworks and being extra cautious for the very sound reasons you mention. I just think that the danger of leaving signs in place when they're not in operation is that drivers may well tend to ignore them when they are in operation. It's a difficult problem though I'll grant you but there must be a better way if shift working is the reason.
|
It is normal procedure when there are overnight roadworks lasting a few consecutive nights for the Traffic Management to remain on site, however, there are also rules and regulations pertaining to the way in which it is left.
Cones are usually moved either to the central reservation or the verge for ease of putting the closure out the next night.
Signs are supposed to be either covered or taken down and laid flat with their legs pointing away from traffic (try working that one out for the central reservation signs) so as not to cause added danger in the event of a vehicle colliding with them.
Similarly the VMS, MIDAS and standard matrix boards should be updated as soon as a closure is taken off and I too find it very annoying when these are left on unnecessarily. The 'crying wolf' description couldn't be more accurate.
Just as a note, if you see a rogue matrix showing 'End', when others the before or after are not being used, I'm reliably informed that this is the unit showing that it is faulty.
PP
|
|
Ok then, if the roadworks are going on over several consecutive nights why not just have additional signage stating the hours during which the roadworks are being carried out and the warning signs are in force ?
|
volvoman, agree with the idea of having times on the signs.
Lane closures on the M25 have been overnight from 28-29 in various locations for drain clearing.
M25 J27-28 lane closure to replace emergency telephones.
Both running from 11/8/03 through to 15-16/8/03.
www.highways.gov.uk/news/crib/index.htm
is really useful if you want to have a look at major route roadworks being carried out by the Highways Agency.
Cockle
|
Fascinating.
www.highways.gov.uk/roads/area/10/works/m6_thelwal...r
So it's possible that we may lose one of the Thelwall Viaducts.
Nice to see that the designers thought things through properly.
|
There's only been one lane open northbound on Thelwall for a LONG time, it's purpose being to service J21 northbound exit sliproad. The rest of the traffic has been on the east viaduct (the new one) for a while now, trundling along at 40mph (watch those cameras!)
There is a MAJOR problem with the bridge bearings which were replaced a couple of years ago. I believe from what I have read in the Civil Engineering press that the problem is due to metallurgical problems within the materials used in the new bearings in the original bridge.
Last I heard, the cost of replacing all of the bearings will be more than the enitre NEW Thelwall Viaduct cost to build - ie more than £30 million...
|
|
|
|
On the subject of matrix signs, there is currently a very dangerous one between J40 and 39 on M6 southbound - it has been showing ALL 3 LANES CLOSED for the past week - with obvious reaction from driver passing for the first time!!!
This evening on the M25 South near the M4 junction.
Matrix signs all lit up on all lanes with 40 MPH plus Queues Ahead. The M25 was quiet before and after this pretty display.
Most ignored it and sailed on at 80.
Should one dial 999 and suggest some action?
Or is there another secret number to call.
If not should a lower priority Motorway problem telephone number be introduced.
Whenever I have dialled 999 re minor lane 3/4 shunts they have always been very responsive even if they are already aware.
Over to my learned friends
|
It's not just the motorways that can have phantom road works. Here in West Wales they still operate with 3 men in an old pickup, the roadside hut, and a collection of road furniture.
Day 1: dump equipment by roadside, set up lights, cones etc, sit in van eating sandwiches, go home.
Day 2 : second van arrives, more equipment dumped, still no roadworks
Day 3 : lights have broken, been knocked over by tractor, or need shifting to include an even longer section of road.
Day 4 : Mark out a few holes ready for digging, but digger not arrived yet, so just tea, sandwiches, then pack up.
Days 5 to 5+x, where x is a very big number: Do the miniscule amount of cosmetic work that was actually needed.
D-Day : work finished, but leave lights for the clearing-away team to remove.
D-day plus 5: everything now removed, traffic flowing again.
D-Day plus 10: time to dig some new trenches in the nice new surface, because a different team need to put down drains, cables, etc etc.
And so on, indefinitely, until the road is due for resurfacing again, or the almost limitless road budget is ready for topping up in the new financial year.
|
|
|
|
|
![2021 Citroen C4 1.2 PureTech [130] Shine 5dr Auto](http://images.honestjohn.co.uk/imagecache/url/crop/90x60/https/assets.heycar.co.uk/t_default-export/f_auto/application_assets/vehicles/pictures/3468ab08ae99910e6410c69cdf8c281c/2e68eca23e0ec11a1f8833cbc7e1d60d.jpg)
![2019 Nissan Juke 1.6 [112] Bose Personal Edition 5dr CVT](http://images.honestjohn.co.uk/imagecache/url/crop/90x60/https/assets.heycar.co.uk/t_default-export/f_auto/application_assets/vehicles/pictures/bd0045844ee50ee2c766dfdff1114b4a/3340cfcc35124cf959e19d7268aa861f.jpg)
![2020 SEAT Arona 1.0 TSI SE Technology [EZ] 5dr](http://images.honestjohn.co.uk/imagecache/url/crop/90x60/https/assets.heycar.co.uk/t_default-export/f_auto/application_assets/vehicles/pictures/8c5bb863fb3c3bf34170c40f378e5051/313186ed0109b9fbd09bfecaf7df0a20.jpg)
