I am not sure, because one of my old university mates has just bought a Puma instead of a TDCI Mondeo (he just accidently saw the Puma, a 30k one owner minter). He is not a car enthuasist but one of my other uni friends (who is female) told him he bought a hair dressers car. Suddenly he knows lots of technical details about the chasis and the engine which I didn't even know and I am quite well up on the Puma.
It is true that my generation were not bought up with spanners though. We were too busy doing things we were not supposed to do with our 14.4kbps dialup modems on our 486 DX2-66s :D.
Electronics as a hobby has died out too probably for the same reason, young people don't like getting dirty.
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electronics has died out because you cant get proper solder anymore and everything worth building has been built in miniture
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True but I loved scaring my sisters friends with my circuits. The scary things I used to make with a 555 timer and an op amp! I convinced her that I had made a bomb once and she kept crying for hours and hours. Many years later (she is now 23) she cried and cried when her car wouldn't start.
With me I think I just love transport and cars are a form of transport :). I can't really see myself ever buying a sports car.
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electronics has died out because you cant get proper solder anymore and everything worth building has been built in miniture
Agree with the second bit, but not the first, you can still get 'proper' 60/40 tin/lead solder no problem. Any tekkie kids these days build their own PCs I suppose, system integrators rather than solderers.
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Where can you find 'proper' solder Spamcan? I'm darned if I can find any.
Not only am I still an electronics and radio enthusiast, I've recently found another English anorak who lives only about ten minutes away from me. Oh joy!
Edited by mike hannon on 29/05/2009 at 13:11
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i would like to know where i can buy solder that works as it should too too mr spammy please
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i would like to know where i can buy solder that works as it should too too mr spammy please
I have a stash of leaded and I'm not giving it up for no-one. Not ever, cold dead hands and all that.
Yes, and the new lead free stuff smells funny too!
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Ok, proper 60/40 tin lead solder with multicore rosin based flux:-
rapid electronics - tinyurl.com/nytx6p
CPC - tinyurl.com/m5l9wr
RS components - tinyurl.com/mneytr
Not cheap mind you!
Bear in mind that there are whole industries that are exempt from WEEE / RoHS directives - military stuff for example - and so proper solder isn't going to go away for a good few years yet.
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>>there are whole industries that are exempt
To the extent that we *have* to use tin lead - the rules that we work under do not allow us to use anything else.
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Thinking about it, 20+ years ago when I worked on military and space microelectronics almost all the solders were indium based ( and cost a grand a reel plus, even then), we only used tin/lead for 'normal' PCB work.
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Thinking about it 20+ years ago when I worked on military and space microelectronics almost all the solders were indium based ( and cost a grand a reel plus even then) we only used tin/lead for 'normal' PCB work.
When I had the misfortune to be employed at that wretched establishment, I used everything from Au/Sn to bog std 60/40. I learnt more about solder and politics than anything else there.
As far as the youth of today, they've always been criticized and always will. Its so easy looking back with rose tinted glasses, however when I've been parked up with plenty of interesting cars about, which I do fairly regularly, there's plenty of youngsters wandering by that are easily diverted if the car is interesting enough. A recent appearance by and Enzo drew large crowd. A month or two early the car that drew most attention was a Lotus Cortina in excellent nick, owned by a waiter of the cafe we met in. He couldn't have been more that 20, so there's definitely some about that are real enthusiasts.
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He couldn't have been more that 20, so there's definitely some about that are real enthusiasts.
Yes, they do exist. Probably in about the same proportion they always did: five per cent if that.
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>>we only used tin/lead for 'normal' PCB work.
The same is true for us - most of our work is producing standard(ish) pcbs for space instruments, where the solder choice is effectively mandated by whichever launch agency we're working with. More exotic solder choices which need a little more metallurgical debate and consideration are needed when we use hybrid microcircuits.
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Unfortunately, street cred seems to extend past the type of car and in to the way it is driven.
Yet again today, I witnessed several more spotty youths, slunk down behind the wheel with the right arm stretched along the drivers window ledge and the left hand casually holding the steering wheel some where at the bottom.
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slunk down behind the wheel with the right arm stretched along the drivers window ledge and the left hand casually holding the steering wheel some where at the bottom.
Oops, that's how I drive!
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There is hope yet. My two year old loves nothing better than emptying all the tools out of my roll cab and tool chests, playing with them and putting them back(admitedly not usually where they came from). When he is a bit older, I think I shall have to try and get him a rebuild project to work on before he discovers computer games.
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I am going to instil in both my daughters the sheer wonder of the internal combustion engine, and the unique pleasure that a Sunday afternoon drive on a sunny day on some lovely winding roads provides, even in the most humble of cars.
Jeremy Clarkson debunked this Green peddled myth of disinterested / car hating kids in a fantastically written article in the Times a few years ago. He described how his daughter kept coming home from school and saying how cars were killing the planet, and people should use them less. Grabbing the keys to the family Focus, he drove his daughter to a disused airfield, where he got out, installed her in the drivers seat, and taught her to drive. He said within half an hour, she couldn't have cared less if Zkylon-B was coming out of the exhaust. The grin on her face was an absolute picture as she steered a 1.6 litre family hatch around a wide open space.
The sour faces might knock driving and car ownership, but it has brought me some of the most incredible and memorable experiences of my life, introduced me to some truly inspirational people, and provided me with independence and freedom. I would consider myself a failure as a parent if I thought I'd neglected to communicate this to my kids, and to drum up any enthusiasm on their part.
Cheers
DP
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I am trying to do my bit too. My 20 month old is obsessed by cars. His first words were "cars" and "doors." He says car and points every time he hears or sees one and won't put his toy cars down. He has even started reading Evo magazine!
Not too sure how we will do with spanners and oil. I'm not good with spanners etc, so won't be a very good example.
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Unfortunately street cred seems to extend past the type of car and in to the way it is driven. Yet again today I witnessed several more spotty youths slunk down behind the wheel with the right arm stretched along the drivers window ledge and the left hand casually holding the steering wheel some where at the bottom.
Yes, its very cool.
Theres a very simple and clever reason why that driving style is adopted. Its to provide extra cover from the door panel and B post from stray bullets and people wanting to asassinate you. You have to be careful out there when you live the life.
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"Yet again today, I witnessed several more spotty youths, slunk down behind the wheel with the right arm stretched along the drivers window ledge and the left hand casually holding the steering wheel some where at the bottom."
Mr X - as opposed to your "Bolt upright, steering wheel 3 inches from your chest, hat centred directly on centre of head, hands together on top of wheel in "dead mans grip" " kind of style?
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I have been a car "enthusiast" for over 30 years, owning some classics such as a Minor Convertible, a 1964 Fintail Merc and since 1996 an E-type .
Unfortunately driving the E-type has become far less of a pleasure. Speed bumps and potholes do not make for a pleasant journey, and the lowering of many national speed limit areas to 40 mph, plus cameras all over the place mean you rearely get to use the performance.
I often went for a drive just for the fun of it, sadly these days the car does very few miles, and my enthusiasm for driving lessens each day.
Happily, we have a boat - the sea offering the fun and freedom that no longer exists on south-easts roads
MVP
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I too am instilling a love of cars in my children.
My eldest can't wait until he's 1.5m tall and can have drive a Mereceds A-class at MB World. One of my youngest son's first word's was 'Landabini' (Lamborghini to you and me) and he can spot car makes at 500 yards (not bad for a 5-year old).
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Happily we have a boat - the sea offering the fun and freedom that no longer exists on south-easts roads
It does still exist. You just have to know where to find it. And when. :-)
Cheers
DP
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"Bolt upright, steering wheel 3 inches from your chest, hat centred directly on centre of head, hands together on top of wheel in "dead mans grip" " kind of style?
Tee hee! Apart from the hat, that's how my middle daughter drives AE. But you have forgotten the phone and one eye on the nipper or nippers in the back. She must have improved and slowed down a bit though, because so far she hasn't crashed her present car.
Generally speaking, girl enthusiasts are a rare breed. Even boy enthusiasts run to a rather tabloid discourse: overexcited by recent supercars, uninterested in real engineering (or aesthetic) class...
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I remember back in the late '70s my mate and I gave the section Warrant Officer a lift back to the domestic side of the airfield (RAF Scampton) and my mate was driving 'casual' with his hands in his lap at the bottom of the wheel.
The WO said in his broad Irish accent, "Corporal, you're supposed to have your hands at the ten past two position."
So he put them there...
The WO then said, "Watch it boyo, you know what I meant."
I nearly bust a gut stopping myself from laughing.
John R
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The boss of Honda said recently that car sales in Japan are being affected by fewer young people learning to drive because they don't need to.
Cars are changing. The future isn't one with throbbing V8's or barking high-revving 4's, it's a future of high-efficiency diesel engines, various types of hybrid drive and also battery electric cars. We though the Bugatti Veyron was the pinnacle of petrolheadism, and it will probably remain so despite cars like the Aston Martin One77 with its square steering wheel!
I think my enthusiasm for cars is more one of interest than thrills, so I find the new challenges of efficiency exciting.
Edited by Sofa Spud on 29/05/2009 at 17:08
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yes I agree Spud - to me cars are interesting technical items and I like seeing different solutions to the same problems...and observing who is on the up and down in terms of brands.
It will be interesting if the general concern for the environment/climate change leads to a leveling off and then slow decline in people who claim or admit in public to liking cars. I work in an office where nobody mentons cars at all - in fact I think alot of people cannot drive and most don't own cars (it's central London). This is such a change from 20 years ago when most straight blokes I knew could barely manage to mention their name before telling me what car they drove and used asking about cars as a good filter on working out how much someone earned, if they were a bit of a lad etc...I never fitted in as I could talk about cars but never owned one at the time. Most odd to them. Still don't own one even though I am more knowledgeable than most car owners on what's what.
For all the Dads with teenagers on here....if your offspring never picked up the car bug...perhaps never learning to drive would you find it odd or could you accept it?
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Very few people really like cars. Men used to feel they had to pretend or try to like them, but most of them didn't really. Cars are so carp for the most part that the reality was always a let-down, and of course most drivers are so incompetent and silly that lots of them got into trouble repeatedly and went off the whole thing. These days their excuse is that the laws and regulations prevent you from enjoying cars. Making a prat of yourself, more like. They're relieved really.
I speak as one who has been totally obsessed with the thing from the age of two or three. I went to eight schools and a large university and have many, many friends. I am 70 years old. In those 68 years I have only met a handful of car enthusiasts. Perhaps two handfuls. Hardly 20 in all out of the hundreds or thousands of people I have known.
When I read crap in the paper by ignorant twits on our 'love affair with the automobile' I have a lot of trouble preventing myself from puking all over everything.
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Sorry Lud, I must be the exception to the rule. As an incurable petrolhead, once a month I head off to the local car meet. A pub car park choc full of hot rods, customs and American machinery from the 1930s to the present day. American muscle cars over forty years old which would seriously embarrass souped up japanese cars with silly exhaust pipes and bodykits in the performance stakes.
In response to the OP, the other week I passed the same pub and there was a Volkswagen owners' cub meet. Pulled in for a look and there were some lovely old Mk 1 GTI Golfs, the majority of owners were quite young and the money spent on these motors must have been considerable, so I reckon that the motoring enthusiast is not a dying breed, far from it.
I would never consider driving a soulless, mass market consumer durable car as it's my main hobby, albeit an expensive one!
Regards, cc
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I agree with lud
I very rarely meet someone who loves motors anymore
they treat them as a tool
Even my own wife doesnt clean her car unless i point out its filthy,as for lifting the bonnet i remind her it needs doing more than once a year.
If i meet a car enthusiast its great but these days i innvariably have to go to some kind of show to get my fix of a man or woman in love with his car
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I agree with lud I very rarely meet someone who loves motors anymore they treat them as a tool
I agree (reluctantly)
My theory to why?
Cars are just SO bland and boring today.
Ive been in the motor trade for 30 years, and I only now get excited when a classic car comes in....
New E class.... YAWN...(needs the anti doze system..... BEFORE you even turn the key!)
5 Series.... YAWN......
Audi.... YAWN.......
Mustang....hmmm..... yawn
Dodge Charger.. Hmmm..............yawn
Daily Drive type? drive with window wide open.... or....ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZCRASH
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Cars are just SO bland and boring today. Mustang....hmmm..... yawn Dodge Charger.. Hmmm..............yawn
And they fall into the bland and boring category how?
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And they fall into the bland and boring category how?
Because.... They are watered down replicas of REAL muscle cars..
Ive not been lucky enough to drive either, but I would love to (note the Hmmm - I was thinking before yawning ;-) lol )
BUT I feel sure that compared to the originals they would be bland(er)...
in my youth I saw and travelled in a lot of 'yank tanks' and a mate had a Pontiac goat (GTO) that would lift the front wheels as it left the line at the Pod...(and was road legal....)
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I'm with captain chaos on this one. Off tomorrow to Scolton Manor near Haverfordwest, for the Pembrokeshire Classic Car Club's annual show. Plenty of nice machinery of all shapes, sizes and ages there, and I'll be taking the old GMC pickup with the express intention of annoying the sandal-wearing tree-huggers as I tell them smugly how many gallons it does to the mile!
I'm lucky enough to have a wife whose dream car is "Eleanor", the Shelby Mustang from the film "Gone in 60 Seconds". And yes modern cars ARE boring, simply because you can't do anything to them any more.
Edited by Harleyman on 07/06/2009 at 00:25
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Ah, Eleanor! Sex on wheels! Wonderful sequential turn signals, same as on the old Cougars and Thunderbirds. Unfortunately, the clowns at VOSA decree that any car post '65 must have amber turn signals. How to ruin a classic. If you don't know what a red flashing light means you shouldn't be on the road
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are you saying that red indicators are not permissable or is it just applicable to later cars that needs a sva?
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are you saying that red indicators are not permissable or is it just applicable to later cars that needs a sva
Any cars post '65 must have amber indicators. I would love to import a classic late sixties Cougar but to comply with UK legislation I would need to convert the reversing lights into indicators. And ruin a classic.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=IdPD8KLPmPc&NR=1
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why not fit the clear philips bulbs that flash orange when powered up then
all the custom lads have them
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The way yank lights work, bb, when you brake and indicate, one side flashes and t'other stays on. That's why the lights get rewired so the reversing lights get orange bulbs in and both brake lights stay on. I've seen stretch limos with light conversions and the reversing lights are either side of the number plate! Confusing and dangerous IMHO. They'd have been better leaving the lights as they were. Yanks seem to manage with 'em ok...
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right gotcha
dont start me on those stretched limos though
at least vosa have finally clamped down on those rotten pieces of ...........
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The Americans "invented" the high level brake light because their confusing all red brake / indicators system caused many "rear enders".
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There are a few of us about.
The younger mechanic at my work is exactly the type of person I was 15 years ago. He drives a mildly souped-up Corsa (frequently quite dangerously) and knows everything there is to know about what makes it work, how and why and what to fix when it goes wrong. What's more, when discussing cars with him, he knows the power outputs and performance figures of virtually everything on the road, down to the individual differences between say 1.6, 1.8 and 2.0 engines in the same model. I have to confess I'm pretty much the same, as is my dad. That could be where I get it from :-)
Dave TD
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I didn't say there weren't any at all cc. Obviously the ones that there are tend to congregate. Look at this place for example.
But how many of your ordinary friends day-to-day are here, or really like cars?
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i hate them
i want to be a fisherman
well maybe not
:-)
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Interesting topic,this. BIL moved over here from the States years ago. Loves it here and treated himself to a classic 323 BMW convertible. When he first came over he was amazed how many of his work colleagues were into cars, organising track days and such like.
Back home such activities are considered redneck pursuits and a sign of low intelligence...
Over in the States, apparantly the car you drive is an indicator of the type of person you are. When my sister first met him and told him I had a Camaro he laughed and said it was the weapon of choice for football jocks and Italians.
Mmm. He was half right... ;-)
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