Hi,
Last Sunday my camshaft snapped while on the motorway. My car is 2005 55 plate SXI 1.2 with 42000ish on the clock. AA man thought it may be a valve or valve spring. Turns out the camshaft has snapped clean in two and two valves also need to be replaced.
Drive (who the car is with) originally quoted 1150ish and have since dropped it to 927 as "they understand its a big amount to pay" or some crap like that. My service history is not full Vaux - only first service was with them and the second service wasn't bang on 2 years, also warranty was up nearly 9 months ago.
Im sure you all understand im not happy and would like advice from anyone who has been successful at getting all costs covered. Alternatively would be up for joining up if there is some sort of group action taking place against Vauxhall.
aussiemcaleer@hotmail.com is my email address if anyone could help.
Cheers.
Edited by Josh1985 on 16/06/2009 at 21:10
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My 55 plate Corsa decided to fail on me today whilst driving on the dual carriageway. Vauxhall said the camshaft has snapped and that it?s only running on 2 cylinders, they have quoted me £405 to fix this but are nice enough to knock off 10% LOL!
I would really appreciate if you could keep me informed of any progress on this.
Thanks
Jas
Jasmin_n_m@hotmail.com
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I can only comment on our experience.
Book the car in to the Vauxhall garage,for them to do the repair, I am sure more damage will have been done, our final cost was £866. and this was less 30% the garage was able to get, but not every body gets the same "good will gesture"
As soon as it in the garage I suggest you send a letter of intent to Vauxhall head office (recorded delivery). They will only respond to pressure at the highest level.
In our case Vauxhall Head Office came back with a 50% "good will gesture"
Ask the mechanic at Vauxhall whether he found any loose Cam shaft Bearing Caps, if so this comment must be added to his Vauxhall Health check report.
If you do get this comment on the report, you are in a good position to get a 100% " good will gesture".but you may have to go ahead with the Small Claims action, Vauxhall will try to settle at 100% before it gets into court.(Court Fee £85)
With regards to our action, Vauxhall have sent us a cheque for £1177.42, which we have accepted, but this is only a portion of our claim, they have not paid for any travel expenses I had included. Because of this, I decided to carry on with the action and have payed a further £35 to file the court allocation questionnaire, We have been notified today that the Pre-liminary hearing is on Tuesday 11th August 2009.
I would still like to receive any info from anyone, with regards to their Vauxhall repairs ie. Copy of your Vauxhall repair invoice, Vauxhall visual health check report (Loose bearing caps) and any other info which may be of help.
Regards
Pete Kershaw.
pete.kershaw@btinternet.com
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There seems to be one common thread here... they snap while travelling at high speed. This suggests that loose bolts could well be the the cause as there would be far more vibration at higher revs and the likelihood of breakage.
If you own one of these (that hasn't broken!), spend a fiver on the sockets needed and remove the rocker cover and check the bolts are tight.
It's literally 10 minutes work. Probably best to have a new gasket to hand as well.
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My 55 plate Corsa decided to fail on me today whilst driving on the dual carriageway.
SQ - no need to quote the full message you're replying to
Well suprise suprise Vauxhall fitted the camshaft but then told me that one of my cylinders is out and that they will have to take the cam head off to investigate. They've come back to me today told me that 3 valves are damaged and that they also got in touch with Vauxhall head office and asked if they would contribute for "good will" but unfortunately although i have full service history I didn't take it to Vauxhall to get serviced. I've been told that this needs 8 and a half hours labour! They've told me that they are discounting some of the labour and that the final cost is £1107! I feel at a lost end. Can someone please give me some advice please?
Edited by Dynamic Dave on 24/06/2009 at 11:20
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My Mum has a 1.2 Corsa and last week the cam shaft went. Apparently the bolts had come loose. It is an 05 plate with 35,000 miles on the clock. She has been asked to pay £1,500 which was then reduced by the garage and then Vauxhall matched the garage offer so she's now left with a bill for £800. My Husband is a senior engineer and worked for a camshaft company for a good few years. He has told her it looks like an assembly problem in her case and that the cam shaft should last the life of the engine. Apparently Vauxhalls are known for this problem (they set up a dedicated line to keep up with replacing one model, which Vauxall did on the quiet at routine services) He has told her to get the cam shaft so he can look at it and go back to Vauxhall with a request not to pay and to mention his job and that we now have the cam shaft for him to look at. She is also going to tell them she is aware this is not just a one off incident and there are many people out there with the same problem. Be interesting to see if they back down and pay her off...
I am angry as she could have been going at speed and then goodness knows what would have happened! There is obviously a problem here and a potentially dangerous one at that!!
Edited by Dynamic Dave on 25/06/2009 at 19:45
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i everyone, i havnt been able to reply for a while but, my corsa is now fixed! after 2 cams fitted as both snapped, valves, pistons, head skimmed, the full wack. as the second cam went less than 24hours after i was given it back after the first one, the guy at the vauxhall garage said he felt guilty it happend again so what would have been over the £600.00 mark he only charged me £160 just for the cam and nothing else. as he said he was going to claim expenses back from vauxhall. although this has been on going for 11 weeks now, although i have my car back, i have still lost out on alot of money. other people have alot more than me but i will still try and claim it back, the only set back is that the garage would notadmit to the bairings been loose. nd im still also having an on going battle with the garage as i have been waiting 3 half weeks now just for a letter of the write up of what they have done.
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I bought my 05 Corsa SXi a year ago from my daughter. At the weekend it suddenly lost power and sounded like a tractor. The exhaust warning light was on. Took it to a garage Monday - they have told me both camshafts have snapped causing something to come loose which has caused extensive damage to the engine. (Sorry I don't understand cars/engines so can't quote exactly what they said and it's still in the garage so I don't have the bill yet). They said it was very very unusual and they can't understand why it's happened. Having to have a recon engine fitted and the cost of repairs is £862.50!! It hasn't been serviced by vauxhall since I've had it so I guess they will disown any responsibility. But I would be very willing to add my voice to any and all approaches to trading standards, Watchdog, etc. I will ask for a written explanation of the damage if that is of any help. To say I'm furious is an understatement!
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We are due to go to the Small Claims Court on the 11th. of August, read our post, Pete and Ed of Tue. 23rd of June. Any info you can get from the garage about LOOSE PARTS would be very halpfull, please send me a copy should you get a statement.
Pete.
pete.kershaw@btinternet.com
Fax.01527 570647.
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We are due to go to the Small Claims Court on the 11th. of August, >>
Pete - After your day in court, would you mind posting on here whether you sued the supplying dealer [under SOGA?] or Vauxhall as the manufacturer [on what basis?]
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Pete,
Have you organised some press coverage for the court hearing?
Your local paper might be interested.
If they run something and there are subsequent hearings, you might get a bandwagon rolling - the story could be picked up by the local telly and others news organisations.
News-wise, your best point is that you are not just one bloke moaning about his car, but there appears to be lots of people with the same problem.
Edited by ifithelps on 23/07/2009 at 20:37
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hi everyone
i bought a corsa 55plate last week from a garage and then read this forum.
i have decided to buy a good private car waranty to cover any mechanical/electrical problems that will no doubt arise. At the moment the general feeling seems to be the camshaft problem is only on 2005 models. My understanding is the twinport engines used on these models is also being used on the new models. Give it another 6months or so and you may find this problem on the 2006 models and then the 2007 models snd so on.
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If I owned a potentially affected engine, I think I would be lifting the cam cover at every service and checking the bolts with a torque wrench set to the correct value. I would become concerned if I found any that moved - especially so if they moved again when checked some time / distance later.
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If I owned a potentially affected engine I think I would be lifting the cam cover at every service and checking the bolts with a torque wrench set to the correct value.
If I owned a potentially affected engine I think I would be getting shut, sharpish.
Not really practical to strip the engine and rebuild at every service!
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I have already booked this corsa into my local garage to have the cam bolts checked/tightened. better late than never. Does anyone think this problem could happen to newer models re-my post above.
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now ive bought the car i have to make the best of a bad job and to cover myself best i can. annie
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I have already booked this corsa into my local garage to have the cam bolts checked/tight>>
I am due to go to court on the 11th of August, I need as much info in writing as possible about Loose Bolts, when you have the Bolts checked,can you get the garage to put the results into a report on his findings, this could be the first report on loose bearing caps, before the Cam actually snaps.
Please send me a copy of any report.
Pete Kershaw
pete.kershaw@btinternet.com
Fax 01527 570647.
{post edited to show the previously hidden quoted message}
Edited by Dynamic Dave on 27/07/2009 at 22:24
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Dear All, Vauxhall have denied any problem with the corsa camshaft but the garage that replaced ours, Eden of Reading, said the problem was only the front one. As if that makes it any better! We are going to go to the small claims court for the £500 odd repair so if anyone is prepared to send me the details of their car and the mileage at the time of cam failure I can cite those cases. The more we share our problem the less chance Vauxhall have of getting away with it. Graham
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You do not have to strip the engine and rebuld, all you have to do is lift the Camshaft cover to get access to the bolts, about 30 min job and a new cover gasket.
Pete.
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sorry i cant be of any help. the garage told me none of the bolts were lose, but on my request they unscrewed them all and re-torqued them to the correct spec.
good luck in court. if there is not enough evidence given either way the judge will make a decision under the law of probability. for example who is more likely to be telling the truth you and all the other people who's 2005 corsa's have all had the same damage or a multimillion pound company trying to cop out of thier responsibilities.
all the best.
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You do not have to strip the engine and rebuld all you have to do is lift the Camshaft cover to get access to the bolts about 30 min job and a new cover gasket.
My comment was "sarcastic" & not intended to be taken literally. Nevertheless the suggestion to check the bolts at every service would add about £100 to the bill. Its only anecdotal/backroom speculation that loose bolts are the cause of the problem and you can bet your bottom dollar that bolts will be over/undertightened and threads damaged by many garages.
So the advice IMO is rather silly.
"I have noticed that a lot of backroomers do not posess the humour gene."
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>>Nevertheless the suggestion to check the bolts at every service would add about £100 to the bill. Its only anecdotal/backroom speculation that loose bolts are the cause of the problem and you can bet your bottom dollar that bolts will be over/undertightened and threads damaged by many garages.
>>So the advice IMO is rather silly.
I don't know where you're getting £100 from
Yes, there is no certainty about the root cause of the failure, I agree. But, checking the bolts can be done for the price of the cam cover seal at every service and represents a cheap and pragmatic step to take until the truth of the matter emerges.
I also don't see that thread damage is inevitable - in most cases, if the bolt doesn't move before the torque wrench clicks out, there's no wear at all.
So, I think your counter advice is rather poor.
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I don't know where you're getting £100 from Yes there is no certainty about the root cause of the failure I agree. But checking the bolts can be done for the price of the cam cover seal at every service and represents a cheap and pragmatic step to take until the truth of the matter emerges. I also don't see that thread damage is inevitable - in most cases if the bolt doesn't move before the torque wrench clicks out there's no wear at all. So I think your counter advice is rather poor.
You obviously live in a world where garages charge zero pounds an hour, and very little for parts and "sundries". You must have also complete faith in garage mechanics and their ability to use a torque wrench correctly (if they have one that is). You don't check the torque on an existing in place bolt by just using a torque wrench to "tighten" it. That is the wrong procedure and could easily lead to progressive tightening on each check. Not to mention, affects of block temperature etc.
So I think your counter counter advice is poorer.......;)
But what would I know as resident whipping boy?
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>>You don't check the torque on an existing in place bolt by just using a torque wrench to "tighten" it. That is the wrong procedure and could easily lead to progressive tightening on each check. Not to mention, affects of block temperature etc.
In this case, simply setting the torque wrench to the right setting and applying it IS enough. If the bolt is anywhere near tight enough, nothing will move, and there will be no progressive tightening as you suggest. If the bolt is grossly loose, you'll feel the torque wrench move - which should set alarm bells ringing.
You still haven't justified £100 - where do you get that figure from?
>>But what would I know
I have no idea - why not tell us what you know?
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You still haven't justified £100 - where do you get that figure from? >>But what would I know I have no idea - why not tell us what you know?
Read my post.
But to make it clearer....
My experience of my Corsa at Vauxhall Dealer
1st service = £190
Request to correct overfilled oil (my mistake) = £75
I do not agree with your torque checking procedure. Bolts will typically show lower tension/torque after being in service for a while - this is accepted in engineering circles. Couple this with the hazards of uncalibrated torque wrenches, performance tolerance of torque wrenchs, torque wrench designs (those that allow to continue tightening beyond the preset value - i.e. most), and bad practice - never heard of that in a garage? ;)
If you dont have any other information other than an inital assembly torque, the correct way would be to loosen the bolt first and then re tighten. You then have the problem of what happens if the (soft aluminium?) block is warm, or you allow oil to flow under the cap/block joint.
To do the entire job correctly, IMO would take far more than 30 minutes.
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£75 to correct overfilled oil?!
5 minute job... That works out at £900 per hour...
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No main dealer garage will charge in 5 minute increments.
I challange anyone to actually go out and drain exactly 0.5 litres from their car and time it from walking out the room to cleaning up. 5 minutes?
Don't forget to fit a new oil sump washer......
And dont forget the time to make out the paperwork.
Lets get real folks......
Edited by brum on 30/07/2009 at 15:15
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>>Lets get real folks......
It's a doddle with a Pela. Suck the oil from the dipstick tube - the graduations on the side of the bottle will tell you when 0.5 litres have been extracted. There's no mess, and no sump plug washer to charge for. 5 minutes, easy.
Vauxhall dealers, or, at least the one I used to work for charged out time in increments of 0.1 hours. 6 minutes - perfect! You were robbed.
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OK, so the £100 comes from dealer pricing - as these cars are coming out of warranty, there's little point in paying a dealer to do this work. You've deliberately chosen the most expensive route to arrive at the price.
To take the other extreme, a decent torque wrench and a lifetime's supply of cam cover gaskets could be had for under £200, allowing careful DIY care for the remainder of the car's life - compared with the costs of camshaft failure, it's a no brainer.
>>I do not agree with your torque checking procedure. Bolts will typically show lower tension/torque after being in service for a while - this is accepted in engineering circles.
We must move in different engineering circles.
Yes, a bolt tensioned by a torque wrench will relax after tightening, in terms of the axial tension. There is also some relaxation of the built in torsion.
However, all of this is dwarfed by the difference between the dynamic friction which was applied as the bolt was tightened and the static friction which must be overcome to move the bolt.
As an example, if you installed a bolt to 8Nm, and then went away and had a cup of tea, to move that bolt anymore, I would be surprised if you didn't need to apply over 10Nm.
The simple procedure as written by me will not detect a bolt which has only relaxed a tiny amount, that's true, but, it will pick up on any gross relaxation, anything that's going to have serious consequence.
>>Couple this with the hazards of uncalibrated torque wrenches, performance tolerance of torque wrenchs, torque wrench designs (those that allow to continue tightening beyond the preset value - i.e. most), and bad practice - never heard of that in a garage? ;)
As I may have written on here before, of the sources of error in torquing a bolt, the accuracy of the torque wrench is the least of your worries, again, uncertainites in the level of friction will dominate - the scatter, either as measured, or as given by specifications like VDI-2230 when using a torque wrench is significant.
>>If you dont have any other information other than an inital assembly torque, the correct way would be to loosen the bolt first and then re tighten. You then have the problem of what happens if the (soft aluminium?) block is warm, or you allow oil to flow under the cap/block joint.
This is only true if you *need* to get back exactly to the as installed condition - there's no need to do that here. The only need is to check and correct for gross loosening. If the bolt is anywhere near being correct, it will not move when the correct specified torque is applied - static friction takes care of that.
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whatever
I'll tell my 18 year old daughter what you suggest.
Edited by brum on 30/07/2009 at 15:32
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Oh, and she can explain everything about her servicing regime to Vauxhall customer services when she's chasing goodwill.
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If you don't want to venture into diy, then find yourself a good local garage or mechanic. They'll be far more consciencious and diligent than a main dealer. If the acne-ridden trainee leaves that all important bolt loose, he's not really going to care. To the self-employed mechanic, any mistakes will be at the cost of his livelihood.
Also, ignore the 20,000 mile intervals - stick to 10,000 at the most.
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New Mastercard advert:
"1st service = £190
Request to correct overfilled oil (my mistake) = £75
Buying a handful of magic beans = Priceless"
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All they do on the 1st service is change the oil and filter, everything else is just "checked".
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As in check off the boxes on the checklist...
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All they do on the 1st service is change the oil and filter everything else is just "checked".
So?
You still pay what they want. Anyone who goes outside the dealer network for servicing within the warranty period will automatically lose any chance of goodwill, both within and outside the warranty period. Its an unwritten rule with manufacturers/dealers, and theres no law against it.
The vast majority of people who own a car would struggle to check the oil level, never mind service their own car. Advising people to get spurious maintenance ops done or to have their cars serviced outside the dealer network whilst in warranty may lead to some very unhappy people later on.
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within the warranty period will automatically lose any chance of goodwill both within and outside the warranty period.
I agree with you in principle, but 'goodwill' seems to be somewhat lacking in these threads.....i for one have taken notice and have crossed this maker off any possible future purchase list.
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Likewise, once bitten twice shy. My 57 Corsa was a nightmare.
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So what "benefits" did you reap from your main dealer servicing, Brum?
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So what "benefits" did you reap from your main dealer servicing Brum?
A lighter wallet, updates to the ECU software that fixed major issues with engine stalling (but not all issues), a Vauxhall stamp in the service booklet, the perception (rightly or wrongly) that Vauxhall or the dealer couldnt squirm out of any warranty/goodwill claim, and the perception that if I sold the car that a Vauxhall history would mean a lot more to a buyer than a "Joe Blogs independant" or "I did it myself" history
As it happened, the car was written off and service history was checked by the insurance assesor, subsequently got a very satisfactory settlement. Probably the best thing about the whole Corsa experience.
Once out of warranty and if I was happy that I would not want goodwill, I would be the first to DIY. (I do service other cars that I and my son has myself). I was never happy with the Corsa and it would have been highly likely that I sold it at the end of the warranty period to mininimise my losses.
I was deeply unhappy about spending £190 for a glorified oil/filter change, but thats life.
No more GM for me, ever.
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I've always bought cars at around 3 years old and run them for many years so the warranty and resale value have never been an issue.
Maybe I'm getting old, but modern cars are far too complicated and difficult to work on.
Remember the Mk3 Cavalier? Rust issues aside, with regular oil changes it would happily plod on for 400,000 miles.
What make have you sworn allegiance to?
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Gone back to Skoda. Time will tell if I made a good choice. Decision was made based on my previous experience with Skoda - both the car and the dealer.
I must say that the Corsa has changed me - I no longer can get enthusiastic about cars - after almost 40 years of driving, I now look at them as just a tin box on wheels that cost me money to park on my drive.
Edited by brum on 03/08/2009 at 15:01
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Brum, I hope the Skoda will rekindle your enthusiasm for driving, given time. VAG cars are different to drive from Fords but in their own way are just as rewarding (as Fords are well-known to be). After only 3 months and 4500 miles I'm fond of my loosening-up Octavia already.
I've never owned a Vauxhall in 40 years of owning cars - and it's telling that I can't remember ever seeing any thread on this forum which was so enthusiastic about the joys of driving a Vauxhall that I have ever felt tempted. (*) I've driven them on occasions, but each time have felt a lack of that vital spark or 'zing' that distinguishes an enthusiast's car from one that just gets you from A to B.
And Vauxhall's attitude and lack of goodwill in what is clearly a common problem with 2005 Corsas is just plain stupid and will turn more customers away.
That said, I'm sure they make very sensible purchases if you're the second or third owner, some company fleet having taken a big hit in depreciation.
(*) Maybe a challenge for Dynamic Dave - a happy Vauxhall owner I think - to find one!
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thing is gm has come out of chapter 11
vauxhall is not part of this as its in limbo as a new owner is sought
at this time it is unclear if old warranty claims will be honoured
io think this is part of the reason closed bids were asked for
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I wonder how many happy Corsa drivers are out there? OK my 99 Corsa Club now has 82,000 miles on the clock. In the past 1500 miles I have had to change four springs, a new back box and exhaust, new MAF sensor and three new tyres but its more due to the fact my standards are a lot stricter than what a quick MOT test will show up. I am hoping thats it now for a long time, though getting the coolant and brake fluid changed soon.
Despite its 82k it uses no oil or coolant whats so ever, returns 50mpg and is very sprighty round the city.
It is just nice to drive with very well balanced electronic power steering (I don't understand the comments about it being over light, I suspect people over inflate their tyres).
All the electrics work perfectly, the engine runs perfectly, its smooth, no miss fires, very good acceleration curve, it only really starts to slow down at 50mph plus. It is still on the original coil pack, lamdba sensor and all the other bits. Only engine work which has been done is a new MAF and a crankshaft sensor fitted in 2004 before I owned the car.
I am not moaning at VX about the work I have had done, its an old car it is to be expected. Springs do seem to be an issue though, never had any problems with Fords and springs.
However I am not sure I would buy a Corsa C, certainly not a 1.2 16v made between 2003-2005 anyway.
There is clearly an issue with camshafts, but on the Corsa site I am member of it is not a widely known problem. This is the only site which really seems to mention it in great deal and that is due to the google effect. There must be at least 100,000 Corsas with the 1.2 16v engine made between 2003-2006 and I suspect all the failures end up being told on this website.
My question is I wonder what the chance of the camshaft snapping on a C actually is? I am not denying there is a problem, just that websites like this can make it seem a lot worse than it actually is.
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I first got interested in Vauxhalls when they bought the Astra and Nova out - at the time they were a breath of fresh air compared to other models at the time. They were so easy and cheap to work on - you could change a clutch in half an hour, for example, and you could always get parts from a breaker if necessary.
Apart from a 16 valve Astra which suffered a few head woes, all the Vauxhalls I have looked after for myself and family have been completely reliable, all seeing well over 100,000 trouble free miles with little more than routine servicing.
Modern Vauxhalls do seem to have lost that practicality, and I wouldn't think twice now about changing allegiance.
The fact is, all cars can and do go wrong, usually at great inconvenience and expense - something we just can't avoid. Yes, Vauxhall may have built a few dodgy Corsas, but you'll find that with any car. That's life!
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Hi Brum - My first Vauxhall service was £143! The second one - £362! As you know, you have no choice if you have taken out finance with Vauxhall, it's in the agreement.
Good luck next week in Court Pete. I sincerely hope that as many people on the site as poss forward you plenty of documentary evidence. We must all stick together on this and stay focused.
If anyone is interested, I asked Vauxhall whether the bolts were ever modified. I have recently received a letter from Vauxhall stating the following:
I can confirm that prior to the production seizing on this model, we released a modification to the caps.
I will be taking out a small claims summons, but intend to get an engineers report first.
Please, if anyone has any documentary evidence, please forward it to me. Many thanks. Alison. greatheathmead@tiscali.co.uk
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>>we released a modification to the caps.
That is the most technically interesting piece of information on the thread. It would be good to find out what the modifcation was.
One possibility would be that the modified caps were made of a harder material to prevent the material under the bolt head from deforming excessively.
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(This is a re-post in order to keep messages in date order)
Just in case this thread is going quiet, I'd like to add another Corsa camshaft failure to the list:
Mine is a 2006 1.0 (The 3-cylinder model). The exhaust camshaft has just broken in two at 35000 miles and 4 months out of warranty
{removed your other post, seeing as it's a repeat of what you've posted here. For reference, posts within a thread are in threaded order, not date order. It all depends on who you reply to, as to where the post ends up. It won't necessarily end up at the end of the thread}
Edited by Dynamic Dave on 26/08/2009 at 14:52
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Any update on the court case?
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And another one bites the dust. I have a 1.4 Twinport Combo Van, 2005, 41K on the clock, FSH and yesterday my front camshaft snapped at 70mph on the M3. My local mechanic looked at it this morning and it would appear that two bolts were loose.
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A friend recently replaced a leaking rocker gasket on his 170,000 mile Vectra 1.8.
With the cam cover removed, he was horrified to find 2 of the camshaft bolts had completely unwound, only halted by the top of the cover.
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