I have a one year Honda Accord Exec icdti on 17" Penta Alloys with Yokohama tyres. I am very happy with the car on the whole but I am irritated by the tram lining on country roads. On motorways it is perfect.
I have been experimenting with tyre pressures and have found that the tram lining virtually disappears if I inflate the tyres to the maximum settings for a fully loaded car.
The car went in for a service and the dealer deflated the tyres to the ?correct pressures? and told me that the front tyres were well worn edge and would be good for no more than 2000 miles (The car has covered 7900 miles from new). The dealer also told me that for my safety the tyres should not be inflated to the higher pressure unless I have a full car load. I am very surprised that the tyres will only have lasted for 10,000 miles as I do not drive erratically.
I also have a Vectra with Michelin Pilot Premacys that has covered 16000 miles with no real sign of wear so I am contemplating changing the tyres on the Honda to Michelin Pilots too.
I was wondering if anyone else has experienced the same problems and has anyone else experienced tram lining with Michelin Pilot Premacys on the Accord.
Edited by Pugugly on 28/02/2008 at 19:42
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Bad news. The Accord on 17" alloys is notorious for this.
Your tyres are worn because you've overinflated them.
Sorry.
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Bad news. The Accord on 17" alloys is notorious for this. Your tyres are worn because you've overinflated them. Sorry.
Overinflation causes wear in the centre of the tread, not the edge?
Edge wear is characteristic of underinflation (and not slowing down for corners, roundabouts).
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I am sorry. I only glanced over the post and never noticed that.
Besides which I thought it'd been a while since I'd given some duff advice!
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No I only increased the pressures for 1 week before the service and the tyres are worn on the outer edge n/s and outer edge o/s. I thought if I had over inflated them the tyre would have worn on the centre?
reading other forum postings on the Omega it would appear that some tyres tram line more than others but I cannot find if anyone has managed to sort it on the Accord
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No you're right. It was me who (unsurprisingly) was wrong.
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I have the Tourer version that I've had from new. I've now done 11,530 miles and the tyres are perfect - Michelins.
I took advice from HJ and kept the 16" wheels rather than specify the nicer looking 17".
I have also increased the pressures to the three up load rather than the fully loaded pressures. This has improved fuel consumption and there is no noticeable tyre wear.
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I wish I had the 16" wheels now :(
The car I test drove had 16" and it was fine and I was unaware of the problems with the 17" until after I had ordered it. I think I will change the fronts to Michelins and hope for the best
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How much extra were the 17" alloys? Would it be completely out of the question to get 16" instead and sell the 17's?
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Unfortunately, this car is on contract hire so I am stuck with the wheels. They gave them as a free upgrade which is why i got them. I now know why they were giving them away for free
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My previous Mondeo TDCi (on 205/55/16's) would tramline and wear the edges of the tyres unless the pressures were at the high speed levels. It also had a much nicer steering response. I ran it at the higher pressures for 20k with no problems and it used less fuel and the tyres lasted longer.
When I picked the new Mondeo up (on 225/40/18's) it was tramlining and I thought I'd made a mistake getting one with big wheels - but having got the car home I found the tyres were 8psi under standard pressure! Having got them at the correct pressure it has all but eliminated the tramlining except on the most severe ruts.
I put it down to the heavy diesel engine directly between the front wheels. Other owners have bought tyres with a greater load rating and found that improved matters as the sidewalls are reinforced. Interestingly, in the manual for the new Mondeo it states that vehicles with Sports Suspension (which mine did) should be run at high speed pressures at all times.
Some people will point out that higher pressures = less grip due to a smaller contact patch. Theoretically correct, but I found running the tyres at higher pressure improved the steering feel and made the car more controllable, which must ultimately be safer.
Pump the tyres up and be done with it.
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Why do Honda fit Yokohama's to the 17" wheels, you only have drive the car 5 miles and you're aware that it's not right.
I too have an Accord tourer which tramlined on Yokohama's, I had Pirelli P0 Rosso's fitted at 13.5k and this cured the problem, so it's not the 17" wheels - it's a wheel/tyre combination.
I'm now on Michelin pilot premacy tyres all round which don't tramline either but they're not as grippy as the Pirelli's, especially in the wet which at this time of year isn't ideal.
Had a couple of moments with the Michelin's under hard braking where the car yawed and I was aware that the ESP was working.
I'm wondering if the extra tread depth on the Michelins is causing tread block deformation under load which is causing the problem?
I ran the Pirelli's at 34PSI which is a little over standard
pressure, high speed pressure made the ride too harsh and grip suffered in the wet.
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How much mileage did you get out of the Pirelli's. I am beginning to think you are correct with the assumption it is a tyre/wheel combination and not the 17" wheels alone
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About 14k but that was mainly motorway, if you were pressing on on A roads I'd expect considerably less!
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netlang,
I have an almost identical vehicle. Both front tyres required replacement at 10,000 miles due to wear in the centre. Honda dealer was the first registered keeper, to 7k miles, and I imagine the car may have been driven quite 'enthusiastically' during this time.
Anyway, I put Michelin Pilots on the front, and in my view the ride is now significantly better, and the tram-lining less evident. On the whole, I wish I'd gone for 16" alloys, although I think the Accord looks significantly better with 17" wheels.
The only other bugbear I have is that crawling in traffic, I find myself changing down from 2nd to 1st more than I would have expected.
The 50-80ish foot-to-floor acceleration can still put a big smile on my face, however, and whilst the trim materials don't look expensive, it does feel very well screwed together.
Chris
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Yep. I have the Accord Tourer Exec with 17" Pentas. Yep, it does tramline occasionally. Doesn't bother me in the slightest. After 15,000 miles, the tyres are fine, plenty left on them. The Accord looks, significantly better with 17". The 16"s just don't fill out the arches enough. I would rather have the car look an awful lot better, and suffer the occasional bit of tramlining. Horses for courses I s'pose.
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let me be the last to let you down....
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What tyres have you used for your 15,000 miles?
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Yokohama's. As supplied. They're absolutely fine. Having read this thread, when the time comes to change them, I will probably change them for one of the alternatives mentioned, but to be honest, the tram lining just does not bother me at all.
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let me be the last to let you down....
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Same here, 17" petnta's on a Tourer CDTI with Yokohama's 16,000 miles on them
Wear bars are just 2mm away. Yes it tram lines, In fact as soon as I drove it out of the car park on a the test drive it was the first thing I noticed, even at slow speed. The grip is just superb though
So I will change them to Pirellis in a few months time.
I am pleased there is a cure.
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I've got a Type-S saloon on 17" wheels/Michelin Pilot Sport PS2 tyres and I've had no problems at all - the front pair lasted 25k and the rears (which are now on the front) will probably last to 28k or thereabouts.
Andy
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I have a Tourer on 16" wheels and Michelins - not noticed any tramlining.
First pair on the front lasted 32k, rears 54k, done 58k now and about 3-4mm left on the fronts. Car 21 months old.
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p.s. Tend to run them at the loaded setting - at the recommended pressure for two up the front tyres look far too soft for my liking. Helps the economy as well!
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32k on Michelin's - Premacy or sport?
That's excellent mileage for a heavy FWD car BTW.
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I have a Primera 2.2Dci new in Dec 2004 (nearly plumped for the Accord but was too much money for less kit) and fell for similar trap to Netlang - drove the SE spec on 16" wheels and bought the SVE on 17". Same problems with tramlining and harsh ride.
Just changed 2 tyres after 32k miles and things have improved. Same tyres though - Dunlop SP 3000 as had limited choice in the size so I can only put it down to pressures.
I think I might try some experimentation!
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Primacy. It is a company car so I don't pay for tyres but I do pay for the fuel!
have managed to avoid the Dunlops Inchcape normally insist on so far.
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Although this model is a bit sensitive to tramlining I suspect the tracting is on the inner limit of the tracking and it is actually toeing in too much thus the outer edge wear and the excessive tram lining effect/oversteer sensation. Regards Peter
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I thought I would update this post.
Yesterday, after a lot of research on this an other forums I bit the bullet and ditched the front Yokohama tyres and replaced them with Michelin Pilot Sports. I have covered just over 100 miles of non-motorwy driving and the tram lining has completely disappeared. I know the tyres are new and need wearing in a bit but the car is now much more enjoyable to drive.
My tyre garage thought I should get around 16K from the Michelins dependant on how the car is driven. We will see?
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Cars tend to tramline easier / more when tyres are past the half worn stage, depends on characteristics of the tyre. Yokohama are normally fairly soft / grippy tyres, that tend to wear quicker then others. Michelins normally last very well, and the sport versions offer decent grip / as do the pirelli rossas. May be worth getting the tracking checked for the uneven tyre wear.
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Cars tend to tramline easier / more when tyres are past the half worn stage, depends on characteristics of the tyre. Yokohama are normally fairly soft / grippy tyres, that tend to wear quicker then others. Michelins normally last very well . . .
Sorry, I don't understand that.
You imply that the Accord was tramlining on the Yokohamas because they were worn, but I understood that the people who had problems with tramlining did so right from the start - before the tyres were worn at all.
I must confess I am curious as to why Yokohamas would tramline more than Michelins - is it simply because Yokohamas are softer / grippier? And if so, why would that make a difference?
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I must admit I thought the same as you tyro. I researched quite heavily into peoples experiences with Tram Lining and I found a lot of owners of Vauxhall Omega's were experiencing tram lining and it seemed to go away when they fitted Michelin Pilot tyres. I was coming across this time and time again so I decided to try Michelins for myself and it is a 100 times better now.
Incidently, on a mk1 Golf GTI fitted with Yokos the ride and handling was superb I just think yokos do not suit the accord or the Omega.
My Tyre garage was explaining to me that all tyres of a low profile will experience some degree of tram lining but he said the Michelins were a very good tyre for longer use. Maybe the Yokos grip too well and this is the cause, I don't know
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I suspect that this is down to tyre/wheel combination.
HJ mentioned that the standard 16" set-up was optimum for the Accord and that 17" wheels spoilt the ride, haven driven both I would agree that with 17" wheels and Yokohama's the standard set-up is far superior.
17" with Pirelli's and Michelin's is fine, no tramlining and ride comfort is good.
Yokohama's have several larger, grooves around the circumference of the tyre which may account for the tramlining.
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Sorry I meant to state that is my opinion not fact. Just based on experience on tyres etc, and also reading long term tests on some magazines, where the testers had reported the tramlining in some tyres getting worse as they wear out - got particularly bad after 1/2 way point. Replacing the tyres cured the problem.
Some tyres will tramline worse then others, don't know if it is the softer compound / higher grip levels - just assuming so.
As suggested it does affect certain tyre / wheel combinations more. Wider tyres I'am assuming worse off.
I know that not all tyres the same size are exactly the same size(!). For example a 205 55 r16 Michelin sits slightly differnt then another brand the same size. I think it may be to do with the compound, or the stiffness of the sidewall (cant remember).
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