Well, it had to happen sooner or later and it has. I've gone through a speed trap at (probably) a speed over the limit.
I was driving Mum to town going up a farily wide road with a relatively steep gradient. Doing about 45ish, get to the top of the hill where it bends so I slip it into 3rd for the hazard and see two flourescent jackets. Naturally I slam the brakes on and go past where I see two young girls who I'm guessing are CSO's. They had a blue band around their hats. One was looking into the tripod with the laser gun on and the other had a clipboard. Definitely weren't Police. Incidently, on the way back, they were at the bottom of the hill on the other side of the road behind a tree.
Now I think it's fair to say, I've been done. I can see the funny side so I'm willing to bet NW is feeling pretty smug ;-)
I don't have any questions but a few things concern me (deja vu from my last meeting with a speed trap);
* They were both CSO's and so, civillians
* I'm not that happy that a failed cop has the power to put points on my licence just by a clipboard. It's hardly as concrete as a video or photograph is it?
* I won't even go into whether the laser was calibrated
Before anyone says it, Merseyside are a pretty no-nonsense force as in - speeding? You're nicked. None of this namby pamby Warning Letter business so I don't see it's that. In a funny way, I'd feel a whole lot better if it had been a cop rather than a civillian.
Whilst I did kill a load of speed, if they had the laser trained on the brow of the hill, I won't have a chance.
Anyway - just thought I'd tell you this amusing tale. I must admit, after punching the dashboard a few times, I feel a whole load better.
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Adam
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If they didn't have a camera I think you will be ok.
With no camera evidence they should stop you at the time & read you riot act (caution you).
Thats my understanding anyway.
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I must admit, after punching the dashboard a few times, I feel a whole load better.
A bit more punching the dashboard rather than the gas pedal, and you can keep on feeling better in the future, even if you get a NIP :)
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NW, if that's your lecture, then I'm happy. I was expecting a lot worse!
With regards to the camer, I'm pretty sure it never had one on. It was quite a big blac thing with a small silver viewfinder on top of it.
The whole setup was on a tripod and I couldn't see any printers or anything like that.
I'll just have to wait and see but I'm pretty certain they've got me.
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Adam
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NW, if that's your lecture, then I'm happy. I was expecting a lot worse!
I reckjn I'll have more fun with a needle than a sledgehammer :)
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In my experience it takes a couple of seconds for lasers to take the first reading after coming into sight and 1-2 seconds for the second reading.
If you're lucky you may have braked in time. Remember 45mph on the speedo maybe 41mph true speed, with perhaps 3-4 seconds to lose another 7.
However, I know the feeling having recently come over the crest of a hill, spot laser van on bridge immediately, look at speedo reading 80mph (70mph limit) ease off, detector beeps once and then again speedo now reads 77-78 spend two weeks doubting my speedo readings thinking why didn't I just slam the brakes on to remove all doubt.
Next time its the brakes, to avoid the worry.
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Since you're only guessing they were CSO's, you could still hope they were theodolite bods.
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Thanks for the encouragement Marc Four and Frostbite but I'm pretty sure they have got me in as much that I was speeding. My only hope is that for some reason, they were chatting and not looking.
Frostbite, that's what my Dad said but since when have survery people worn hats?
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Adam
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What is it with me and the word "SURVEY".
I'm probably thinking of carvery which reminds me. I'm hungry. Off for some food!
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Adam
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Unless you're driving a blue car (not gold) with Everton flags in the windows and singing "I love David Moyes" at the top of your voice, I don't see how anyone could get nicked tonight in Liverpool.
If they do send you a NIP, send it back claiming Benitez, Carragher or Dudek was driving. Should get you off.
-- Lee Having a Fabialous time.
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If what you say is correct, and these two were PCSOs, then I don't think what you went through was a speed trap because PCSOs don't the relevant authority to man mobile speed traps.
Now granted each Force can vary in what they use PCSOs for - but their actual powers are fixed by Law. ..and I see no mention of Speed Enforcement - although by the same token, they could be trained to use such devices, but then they would usually be accompanied by a 'Police Officer'. I'd be more inclined to call the local Station and ask them about what you had seen etc. and sound them out.
I personally think you didn't go through a trap myself. Time will tell I guess.
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Im not plain stupid, just a special kind of stoopid.
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Well Adski - commiserations on your situation. I've been having discussions with our local police and it appears that they are keen to extend the use of mobile speed traps to non-traffic officers and others, possibly CSO's in order to make up for the fact that the traffic section are seriously overworked and under-resourced. If this is the case you may well have been nabbed by them.
In any event see it as a learning experience and be philosphical. Failing that, become a premier leagure footballer, earn £££££'s pw and then fight the case on legal aid. :)
Best wishes.
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Round my way speed detection devices are loaned to the parish council. Locals in day glo jackets man the "trap" but the worst offenders get is a warning letter. Pretty effective in slowing down speeders nonetheless!!
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Adam... behave... PCSOs are not failed police officers, they are employed to do a different role to that of an officer.
That aside though, PCSOs don't have the powers to man speed guns in Hampshire, and I didn't think it was one of their powers at all but could be wrong. Were there police officers anywhere nearby and did they have a laptop? (Am thinking it might have been mobile ANPR?)
Hate to break it to you, but most people who get points from guns and cameras get them from civillians as the people who man cameras tend to be from the safety camera partnerships and not police officers.
Hopefully yours wont come to anything.
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Thanks for the words of encouragement people.
I'd just taken the Liverpool flag off as well Lee ;-)
ihpj - They were absolutely, positively without doubt PSCO's unless the Police have changed their uniform. I got another glance on the way back doing 25mph on purpose. (To the 6 cars who tailgated me from the top of the road, don't mention it)
VM - it's entirely likley it was a bone fide speed check and they have the power although I hope not.
Bromptonaught - I hope a warning's all I get. I really do.
PG. We'll agree to disagree. I can't think of why anyone would willingly be a PCSO but that's me. Obviously there's an attraction somewhere.....there's got to be.
>>Hate to break it to you, but most people who get points from guns and cameras get them from civillians as the people who man cameras tend to be from the safety camera partnerships and not police officers.<<
Thanks for making me feel better! ;-) The only difference here is that there is no evidence except a clipboard. What's to stop them seeing me parked up, realising it was me that bullied them at school and then writing my numberplate down for the hell of it?
and finally...
..DVD. I am the registered keeper. I followed the road to the end and there were no cops. (Although it was a 10 minute walk from the cop shop.) I'll hold my hands up - I was speeding. And if a proper copper had pulled me or was by the laser gun then fine. But what "training" do you go through as a PCSO?
We'll wait and see. Got to thank you all again for your help though. As always, it's very much appreciated.
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Adam
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Adam... behave... PCSOs are not failed police officers, they are employed to do a different role to that of an officer.
Ahem. Not failed police officers, failed wannabe police officers, if we're going to be picky about it.
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>> Adam... behave... PCSOs are not failed police officers, they are employed >> to do a different role to that of an officer. Ahem. Not failed police officers, failed wannabe police officers, if we're going to be picky about it.
They're not, and in fact if you actually speak to them, you'll find that most applied because of the community aspect of their role, and have no desire to have the enhanced powers and take the flack and paperwork that officers have. As it's not motoring we'll have to agree to disagree. ;)
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Ahem. Not failed police officers, failed wannabe police officers, if we're going to be picky about it.
>>
Well I cna't say that I disagree :P
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Im not plain stupid, just a special kind of stoopid.
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Agree with ihpj Adski.
As far as I am aware the powers of CSO"s have not as yet been extended to the prosecution of speed offences. However they are being used for the collection of data. In my old Force area they, in company with Fire Brigade, tout the automatic speed warning Matrix boards about the County.
Known that some Forces do what Bromptonaut mentions and if the problem is confirmed they call in the heavies and prosecute.
Generally where hand held is used there is a stopping agent further down the road which you do not mention.
Could well be that they were carrying out a speed survey to see if a complaint is justified. A function not that they were intended for IMHO.
If you are the Reg Keeper of the vehicle you were driving count 15 days from time and date and nothing in the post breathe easy.
DVD
DVD
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Could have been ANPR but usually mobile patrols further along the road to catch the suspects.
Yesterday I went past an unusual one. In a concealed entrance on my offside, facing me, there was a HUGE brown box on a tripod, pointing my way. Behind it there was a contractors van complete with bloke in fluorescent jacket milling round outside. maybe it was doing something automatically, or maybe he was bored...I hope I never find out!
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They're the new military tracking systems for the war games smokie.
Expect to see a company of Chieftan tanks in a staggered wedge outside your house very soon.
;-)
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Adam
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Adam, that car of yours is so damn ugly it would shatter any camera lens - you are safe.
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Besides, hearing aid beige doesn't register on digital cameras.....
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Can I assume you didn't get anything in the post?
Merseyside is getting worse, remember may 19th?!
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Nope - I still haven't received anything.
I've been talking to a few people and apparently, I should have got a warning letter so obviously Merseyside are doing that now. I can only presume that upon seeing the day-glo jackets, I slowed down fast enough before they could get a reading.
Lucky escape eh?
Thanks to everyone for all of your help.
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Adam
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Well Adski - commiserations on your situation. I've been having discussions with our local police and it appears that they are keen to extend the use of mobile speed traps to non-traffic officers and others, possibly CSO's in order to make up for the fact that the traffic section are seriously overworked and under-resourced. If this is the case you may well have been nabbed by them. In any event see it as a learning experience and be philosphical. Failing that, become a premier leagure footballer, earn £££££'s pw and then fight the case on legal aid. :) Best wishes.
Or become a police officer and say you were familiarising your self with your car.
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\"Nothing less than 8 cylinders will do\"
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