Cloned number plate or dislexic warden?
I got back to the UK after Christmas in Oostende to find a letter from the Lothian & Boarders Police (Central Ticket Branch) informing me that as I had not paid the Fixed Penalty Notice (FPN) for parking in a no waiting zone in Bathgate (near Livingston) on the 20/11/03 I had to pay by 16th Jan or risk court action.
Thing is, the car was parked up (all day) outside the office where I work in Blackburn (Lancashire, not the Blackburn which is 5 miles from Batgate!) with me at my desk all day.
I have sent a statement to the ticket office disputing the FPN and am waiting for a responce from them.
I really do not need the hassle and bother of fighting this through the courts or by arbitration. Why can't the warden who issued the ticket not only record the number plate but also the VIN & or Tax disk info to ensure accuracy. I am convinced they have transposed digits (a common form of mild dislexia which I also suffer from).
Any advice would be greatfully recieved.
PS. I did not lend the car to anyone for them to drive 500 miles to Bathgate and back in the afternoon.
John R
|
Stand your ground, it's much easier to fight from a position of innocence.
If you have timesheets at work, or some form of checking your movements (e.g. swipe cards), you could ask your company to confirm that you were in the office at the time the alleged offence was committed. Confronted with this evidence, I cannot see that they would pursue the case. I realise that, of course, this doesn't guarantee the whereabouts of the car, but it should certainly help your case.
Best of luck.
|
|
|
|
this is unfortunate and i feel for you. although you dont need the agro you absolutley MUST NOT let them get away with it, pursue it through the courts if you have to as a matter of principle.
|
|
|
This simply highlights the inherent problem in the direction that modern traffic enforcement is now moving.
Everything relies on the numberplate and the registration system. An error in either data set means that someone like John R now has to prove his innocence beyond all reasonable doubt.
My worry is that my numberplate will be cloned by someone living near me - that way I will not have the almost cast iron defence that John R has been able to present.
|
|
I too worry about this and it's one reason why I've put some easily distinguishable marks on the rear of my car. Of course doing this won't prevent all the hassle involved in such circumstances but at the very least it should enable me to prove it isn't my car on any photo generated by an enforcement camera. Providing it really isn't my car that is :-)
|
But do you have proof that the marks are there now, in advance of the offence? Otherwise it could be asserted that you added them after the event.
Is it possible to ask DVLA for a new VRN if you think you've been cloned?
|
If the make, model and colour of the Scot is the same as yours then its 10 to 1 down to an inept Warden.
If different then the Scot is a cloned VRM.
DVD
|
Get a grip DVD shouldn't that be the other way round?
DVD
|
|
|
John,
I think where you coming from on this is why should you have to waste your own time and money proving you are innocent, would I be right?
In this I fully agree with you. The whole mechanism of these 'minor' fines is being set that the accused must do so and the hope is clearly that the perosn will say, hell I'll just pay at it will go away.
The fine structures are being set at £30/60 for cash now but automatically ramp to £1,000 if you challenge it. Some people particularly the elderly will pay up even if innocent as they fear the consequences of not doing so too much.
I believe this used to be called demanding money with menaces.
|
|
|
|
|
Only the fact that because they've been there so long if they'd been either moved or recently added it would be obvious. I guess I could also have taken some photos of the car with say a current newspaper clearly displayed on it but maybe that's going too far down the road to paranoia :-)
|
|
take pic, and post it regsitered to yourself - and leave the envelope sealed. That's it date-stamped. I'm STILL getting info from the local boys in blue over the clone of my car which keeps getting parking and speeding tickets. Unfortunately, there is no pattern to them, so we can't go and find the git!
|
|
Just like establishing copyright ?
|
£30/£60? Lucky you. £50/£100 for me last Friday morning. In residents parking area, not another car in the road. Put money in machine; no ticket came out - money wasted. Next machine wasn't working either. Assumed traffic wardens wouldn't be. Wrong!
I'd even been to get a new permit for my new car last Tuesday, but... the parking 'shop' wasn't taking credit cards so I couldn't. But I could pay the parking ticket by credit card and post it to the self same parking 'shop'.
Unreasonable taxation. What net good is there to the community from this. No point arguing, entirely my fault.
|
>No point arguing, entirely my fault.
I would, but then I'm like that! You paid and machine didn't give ticket - I'd be straight onto them. ISTR that many complaints they just give in to, rather than bother the adjudicator - you haven't much to lose anyway!
Mind you, I live in an area of the country that hasn't really discovered charging for parking yet!
--
RichardW
Is it illogical? It must be Citroen....
|
I agree with RW and would appeal. Mind you they might just say that you're only allowed to park if you have a ticket and if you can't get one because the machine's broken then you have to park elsewhere.
BTW RW, I'd keep that bit about living in an area where they don't charge for parking quiet if I were you. You might just be putting ideas into their heads :-)
|
|
|
> you haven't much to lose anyway!
Well only another 50 qquid to lose. If you want to appeal you have to wait 2 weeks. By the time 2 weeks are up it has gone up to 100 quid. So it's double or quits. I'm the biggest arguer on the planet, but even I know when to give up.
|
|
Yes the double or quits policy seems exceptionally unfair to me, okay up the price if someone doesn't pay but contesting guilt/innocence should not be a gamble!
|
|
I think the double or quits policy doesn't apply if you make a challenge. Worth checking perhaps?
|
My experience in Harrogate last year was that whilst the matter was being considered the 'double cost' clock was stopped. I was advised (in writing) that it only restarted after a decision to confirm or delete the ticket was made and notified to me.
PS they did agree to delete the penalty charge notice after two letters :)
|
|
"I would, but then I'm like that!"
As noted in "I have a question volume 28"!!!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
John, I happen to work in Bathgate!, want me to have a word with the traffic warden???? :)
Seriously though, if you were able to supply details of street, registration etc (via the mods if reqd) I could check it out in the off chance, unlikely but possible, that there is another car which regularly parks there maybe one digit out from yours, or in different sequence??
|
|
|
Hi John R
I ***think*** that all Lothian wardens use Digi Cameras to record offenders in position when ticket is issued. Whilst this is not checked prior to notice being sent out, it can then be checked in event of challenge. I may be wrong in this but hope not. Good luck with the case.
JohnM
|
To All...
Thanks for all the replies, I have just spoken to the ticket office and they have put the FPN "on hold" and I should wait for a written reply.
I think JohnM52 may be right, and they have looked at a photo and realised it was not my car.
DVD was correct in that the make & model are the same as mine, but Daewoo do block registrations and I have seen a daewoo like mine & similar registration, the numbers 492 whereas mine is 429.
The feeling is that I have to prove my innocence rather than the powers that be proving I am guilty (beyond all reasonable doubt).
I will not just "pay up" to save the hassle but am out of pocket already (2 phone calls and 97p for recorded delivery letter & paper, ink and envelope) it's not much but it's the principal...
I will keep you informed of what their letter says.
John R
|
|
Why not send them an invoice for your time and expenses?
|
|
After all, if they prosecuted and lost then they'd have to pay costs.
|
|
|
I may do that, we'll see what their letter says first.
John R
|
You'll be lucky! Just a waste of more ink, paper & stamps, as well as increased blood pressure.
Saying that, I got £35 out of a bank this year. Though not very much I felt very proud! A standing order for £100 was paid by mistake - after it had been cancelled. They wrote asking for it back, I deducted an administration fee and sent them a cheque for £65. They wrote back and said 'thank you'.
|
|
|
Headline NEWS... (update)
Backroomer John R :¬) is INNOCENT of parking offence.
"I always new the truth would prevail" says John R.
A letter arrived yesterday from L & B Police, explaining that the issuing officer had noted the wrong registration number. They also apologised for "any inconvinience caused...".
Relief all round...
John R
|
|
|
|
|
|
