i have a 94 Honda civic LSI thats done 100,000 miles. Shes a lovely little runner but I am getting through more brake discs than petrol.
I had none Honda ones on there that lasted 3 months before they warped. I got a new set and they lasted 3 months before again it was stopping like a shaky set from Blakes 7.
Do you think that I should just be less of a tight wad and shell out for proper Honda ones (bearing in mind they could cost more than the cars worth)OR Do you think there is something more sinister???????????
Is this a common fault with this car?
shaken but not stirred x
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Hi 007,
You did say shaken but not stirred, didn't you?
Your discs should last 3 to 4 years.
If not, something bonkers is being done.
Right, we know where we're at now, don't we?
Understand that the face of the pads imprint precisely, equal and opposite, onto the discs.
You do change the pads each time that you change the discs don't you?
If the discs wear more often than I said, they are holding on to the pads (vice-versa, really, but you get my drift). So, have you got air in the fluid? Pads not retracting. Caliper seals holding on.
Honda's are built like Rocky, like VW.
I ride a Fireblade in my nutcase times. I'm in deep love with Soichiro. A brilliant engineer. You will see 1 or 2 if you keep coming here.
Thank you for a superb post, my friend.
I WILL help you. Write back, please.
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Is the mounting flange spotlessly clean?
What make of discs are you fitting?
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Brake binding/drag would be the first thing I would eliminate as possible cause. Beyond that, I have heard of wheel lug nuts being done up too tight thus causing the discs to warp from excessive or uneven force placed on the studs.
I have never personally experienced this as I am the only one who removes/replaces my wheels, but apparently less caring mechanics can get a bit enthusiastic with the impact wrench. Check that your wheel lugs are being tightened to the correct torque value.
I am no expert so bear that in mind whenever you read anything I post, however what I am suggesting costs nothing to try and certainly won't cause anymore damage.
Sean rides a Fireblade???, I never would have imagined that. I had a 1993 model only they weren't called Fireblades over here.
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Do you keep the brake on after stopping?
Sean's point about the pads imprinting equally but opposite is valid here, if you keep your foot on the pedal after stopping, especially from speed the heat dissipation from the pads is unequal cos the section of disc under the pads will contract at
a different rate to the rest of the disc.
New discs wivout new pads is a money wasted - god knows what crap is embedded in pads. Least you can start off with perfect
mating surfaces (after bedding in).
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You need to fit new pads and new discs together, as others have said. Check that the calipers move freely.
Clean the mating surfaces of the disc and hub assy. Fit the new discs and then check run-out with a dial indicator - hopefully it will be 50%, or less, of the limit given by Honda.
Always torque your wheel bolts with a torque wrench, and to the Honda spec. If using alloys then re-check torque after 600 miles.
There is a possibility that your front suspension is overly sensitive to disc run-out as a consequence of e.g. bush or balljoint wear - so check all suspension joints carefully.
If using non-OEM discs then try BREMBO - they are good.
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Malcolm_L,
good point, but would'nt this make all automatics more vulnerable to this? Or do autos have stronger discs to compensate for this?
Always questions, questions.....
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Andy B,
I suppose it would - I don't think any manufacturer would
use different discs for auto as opposed to manual - it would impact on production line efficiency.
I picked the tip up from the garage that replaced the warped discs on a Transit minibus - this had been used for towing and
the brakes had been worked hard.
Where would this site be without questions?!
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Auto's have the same discs.
Never had an auto with a warped disc - I don't particularly believe the business about warping being due to holding the brakes on - the conductivity of the steel is pretty good. Not only that, but discs have to cope with much bigger thermal gradients (e.g. driving through floods and deep puddles) and don't seem to warp. Even if you take your foot off the brake there is only a very small gap (<1mm) between the pad and the disc - not much cooling from the air in there.
I think 9 times out of 10 disc 'warping' is due to either poor fitment (not flat to hub) or a poor disc (either bad machining or poor metal). A couple of year ago I bought some cheap replacement discs for a relative's Audi (from a well-known supplier...) they were made in India and wore out in about 8 months.
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I've come across similar LDV and Iveco brake disc problems. In each case the manufacturer claimed that braking hard and holding the brake on when stopped affected heat dissipation. They both suggested that 'driver education' would sort the problem out.
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Carrick
If holding the brake on leads to warp discs then all auto's would suffer - in the USA that would mean about 90% of cars driving around with warped discs.
No - its down to quality of materials and design. When my father ran his independent 'shop (a good few years ago now) nearly every 'old style' Rover 200 that he worked on had some disc warping, to a greater or lesser extent.
On the other had he worked on quite a few Mercs W123/124/201 series - many of them autos - and never encountered a warped disc.
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Aprila,
Agree about good quality materials and competent fitting. I've fitted cheap aftermarket brake components and regretted it.
And I'm not saying that all warped discs are caused by keeping the footbrake on after braking.
As I understand things, disc distortion can arise when a cold brake disc is rapidly heated and not allowed to cool uniformly. As you say, iron is pretty conductive anyway - but if a small area of a hot disc is kept hot (by a hot brake pad clamped onto it) the disc can't cool uniformly. I know that the clearance between a disc and pads when 'off' is minimal but it's enough to prevent a heat build up in that area
The Iveco 7.5t. lorries I maintain are fitted with Brembo discs from new and the rear pads and discs invariably wear faster than the front.(Same components, front and rear). The load sensing valve does it's best but can't compensate for the fact that after braking the rear discs are clamped by the parking brake using the same pads that have just heated the discs to maybe red heat. Heat cracked and warped rear discs are common.
Bad drivers can destroy even Brembo brakes within a few miles, I've seen perfectly seviceable front discs heavily 'blued' and split with deep heat cracks after only a week with a racing driver.
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Aprilia,
Looking at the threads - no-one is saying that all warped discs
are down to holding the brakes on - the example I originally quoted was for a Transit which hauled a heavy trailer.
Excessive heat and holding the brakes on does appear to cause problems, everyday driving doesn't generate the heat required.
I do agree that non-oem parts are a significant problem, a pattern brake disc will look just like the real thing but could be made from low grade steel which will wear/warp in no time.
Better design and/or greater dissipation characteristics would probably explain the Rover/Merc issue.
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jpfarrello you can get good japanese replacement parts for your Honda, supplied under the brand name of "Footprint". I have used this brand and they are completely reliable. Your local Japanese Motorfactor will supply you with reliable Jap parts. Of course it is always good to see if brake pads etc match original eqipment. I think a firm or brand called "Solid" make brake parts or used to. Check that the discs are fitted ok- run out etc like the others suggest. Do the job by the book, not as you see fit.
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I think you mean 'Blueprint', don't you?
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Try getting the discs skimmed next time, You may find that the overheating that caused the warping has now heat treated the disc and the vibration wont return!
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