We take this for granted,most new cars offer it I have had it for the last 6years and as far as I am aware has never cut in.Imagine my horror when a spongy brake pedal was found to first a master cylinder at £300 and an ABS pump at £1000 I have a mindto make sure my next car is the Basic model without all these bells and whistles to go wrong
ndbw
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Try getting a car with ABS today and you'll be driving...er.... A Fiesta! Not for long though, gonna be a legal requirement soon...
Blue
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That is the trouble with modern cars--they are great until they go wrong and then the expense starts. The days are gone when one could 'tinker' with bits of wire and tape to get things going again.
The question is: do we really need electric windows, electric sunroofs, electric mirrors, automatic wipers, etc. etc?
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Agree! Progress really ought to be forwards. I guess it is progress for the marketing men though.
Baz
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I guess it depends on what sort of motoring you do. I have a 17 year old Nova that I use for about 5,000 a year back and forth to work, to school and shops in the Cotswolds. On a really long trip I can be in the car for 25 minutes and some times I go as fast as 60. I certainly don't think electric windows, Aircon etc are essential or even desirous when you consider the cost of keeping/fixing them. On the other hand when I take do a couple of thousand miles in a few weeks down through France in the summer give me the lot.
I think there is a market for both types of car but the motor industry seems determined to do 'car door window handle manufacturers' out of a job.
£1000 for a pump is stupid - You can get twenty 17 year old Novas for that.
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Just for interest , can anyone suggest a car in current production that is a basic model , not from the third world and could be regarded as a quality vehicle easy to repair and has no whistles and bells ? Ideally with a fairly large engine,1.6 or so, and four doors would be nice.
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If you'd asked that about 3 years ago I would have said a Mondeo Aspen, not even any electgric windows, but even Ford won't be that stingy with the spec now...
Blue
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Did these repairs fix it? Did the garage just try bleeding the brakes first?
reading between the lines, the new master cylinder didn't cure the problem? Did you pay for it anyway? Why couldn't they fit a new set of seals to the cylinder?
Did the garage tell you how the abs pump caused a spongy pedal? As a learning point I'd be interested to hear the explanation.
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I understand that if you've never or rarely provoked actuation of your ABS you might think it's a waste of money, but like so many safety devices they're not put there to achieve value for money but to make your journey safer in the event of the unexpected. You only need to use any of the "modern" safety devices once in order to save your life and suddenly they've become worthwhile.
KB.
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I believe in having as many safety features as I can afford. So, for me, seat belts/ABS/air-bags are a must - even though I hope that these features will never have to come to my aid.
However, I do tend to agree with the views expressed about some "superfluos" extras such as electric windows/mirrors on the driver's door. However, these do come in handy for doors away from the drivers reach.
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Safety devices are now as important in marketing a vehicle as "extras" sch as a/c, and electric whatevers. However, time will tell whether these extras are really worth the money.
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Post-script: If I could aford it, I would drive the safest car which quoting HJ "It?s the safest, quickest real-world car you can get your hands on". Now that car does have quite a list of gizmos, some which are safety related and others which are pure luxury! For details, see
www.honestjohn.co.uk/road_tests/index.htm?id=61
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Cars are moving towards a throwaway item. One of the reasons for the ever tightening EU rules on recyling cars. Its endemic in everything we buy, cars, computers, fridges, tele's.....
Manufacturer need us to buy NEW things, so they design shorter lifetimes of exising items, and increase the wizz bang factor of the new things. We, the consumer, have the illusion of greater value for money.
But hold on, think how much we would pay in real terms for a car of late 60s spec. or early 70's spec? My first capri cost me 1,300 pounds new. To build the same car today (using current manufacturing techniques) would cost? well i bet about 1,300 pounds. A years wages 25 years ago, less than a months now.
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The usual reason for this happening is water being present in the brake fluid (it's hygroscopic0. The water attacks the ABS pump and the corrosion acids then go for the master cylinder and slave cylinders.
Did you have the brake fluid changed every 2 years during your 6 year tenure?
If you don't like changing fluid, you can do it just once, with DOT5 which is silicon based and non-hygroscopic.
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Yes the fluid was changed every two years,the service book has every stamp for all the required service iterms
ndbw
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I agree about the need to question all this expensive sophistication, but having said that, about a week after I bought my new C5, two young deer ran out right in front of me. The automatic brake assistance feature kicked in - the car stopped (boy, do I mean stopped!) the hazard warners came on and the two little bambis scrambled over the fence unscathed. (Better that than scrambled over my new bonnet.)Even in my previous Xantia I would have been hard pressed to avoid hitting them - and Xantia brakes are pretty hot!
The brake assistance hasn't come into play again (12 months / 16,000 miles later)but I thanked my lucky stars that my pristine pride and joy hadn't been damaged. (Sorry, I'm not a great animal lover.)
I've often thought to myself, however, there might be a niche for a 'simple' car made to today's engineering standards. Eg my parents had a 1960 Hillman Minx. Straightforward RWD, 1500cc inline engine. Now if we took a similar layout with a modern engine unit, decent disc brakes, possibly slightly better suspension and say, good corrosion protection - but leave out all the electrical 'luxuries' I wonder if it would sell?
Graeme
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Well I'm sure that I wouldn't buy one, I'm afraid I'm too attached to having power steering and electric everything.
I'm perfectly happy to keep paying for it when it goes wrong simply because I value it so much. I tried imagining life without my in car CD player but the images were too scary to contemplate!
Also, as somone said, if you spend a lot of money on gizmos such as ABS and multiple airbags throughout your driving career, and they come into play to prevent a nasty accident or lessen the injuries just once, then it was all worthwile...
Blue
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