Advice on Small Claims Process

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Sun 3 Oct 2021 09:49
Advice on Small Claims Process - Bernardo Kerr

Hi everyone,

I bought a 2009 Peugeot 207 at the very end of July and it stopped working within less than a week due to a blown head gasket (had it sniff tested). As soon as I knew what was wrong, I spoke to the garage who sold it to me (recorded phone calls) and sent them letters to request a repair/refund under the Consumer Rights Act (recorded delivery), and all I've had in response is intimidation attempts or just ignoring letters. I'm at the point where I'm about to start a small claims process but before doing this I thought it would be a good idea to seek advice from people with more experience of what all this involves – hopefully someone here!

So, a few questions:

  1. Is a blown head gasket something that should count under the Consumer Rights Act? My thinking is that generally it shows underlying issues and really shouldn't happen within a few days of buying the car, but that's just from limited research.
  2. How long does a process like this tend to take?
  3. Would I need to pay for MOT and other costs while all of this is happening, and would these costs be eligible for compensation by the garage if I win?

Thanks so much for any help you can give!

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Sun 3 Oct 2021 10:39
Advice on Small Claims Process - _

You bought a 12 year old car.. How much did you pay, mileage, service history, etc.

You MUST give the dealer a chance to repair it.

Then send a letter before action and give chance to reply, and Then and only Then start the small claims process.

Chances of success? depends on the car advert? did you keep a copy..

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Sun 3 Oct 2021 15:18
Advice on Small Claims Process - Bernardo Kerr

Thanks for the reply. I paid £2,000, the mileage was 65k, no service history (yes, I've learnt from that). I gave the dealer the chance to repair if he would pay for it to be recovered from my home, as the repair should be made without undue inconvenience to the buyer according to CRA, and it would've cost me hundreds to have it taken over to their garage.

Unfortunately there was no advert because I bought it before they listed it.

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Sun 3 Oct 2021 10:41
Advice on Small Claims Process - galileo

Hi everyone,

I bought a 2009 Peugeot 207 at the very end of July and it stopped working within less than a week due to a blown head gasket (had it sniff tested). As soon as I knew what was wrong, I spoke to the garage who sold it to me (recorded phone calls) and sent them letters to request a repair/refund under the Consumer Rights Act (recorded delivery), and all I've had in response is intimidation attempts or just ignoring letters. I'm at the point where I'm about to start a small claims process but before doing this I thought it would be a good idea to seek advice from people with more experience of what all this involves – hopefully someone here!

So, a few questions:

  1. Is a blown head gasket something that should count under the Consumer Rights Act? My thinking is that generally it shows underlying issues and really shouldn't happen within a few days of buying the car, but that's just from limited research.
  2. How long does a process like this tend to take?
  3. Would I need to pay for MOT and other costs while all of this is happening, and would these costs be eligible for compensation by the garage if I win?

Thanks so much for any help you can give!

How much did you pay for it and did it have a new MOT?

Put the reg no into WBAC for a value of the car, this may be useful info.

Citizens' Advice or |Trading Standards may give you helpful advice, try them before Small Claims which could take some time.

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Sun 3 Oct 2021 12:17
Advice on Small Claims Process - sammy1

Does it matter how much was paid? Dealers have an obligation to sell road worthy vehicles and clearly a blown head gasket noticed within a weak should have been dealt with by the dealer. The dealer is not interested so Citizens advice and small claims only way to go.

By all means get the car road worthy but if you are realistic you may not get any money out of the dealer but small claims court costs little.

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Sun 3 Oct 2021 15:21
Advice on Small Claims Process - Bernardo Kerr

Cheers for this, Galileo and Sammy. From what I understand, the amount I paid is relevant in small claims because they can say that if I only paid a couple of hundred then the expectations are lowered... something like that. Seeing as I paid £2,000, I think I was right to expect better than what I got! WBAC says I'd get something like £200 and that's if it was working.

Edited by Bernardo Kerr on 03/10/2021 at 15:21

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Sun 3 Oct 2021 23:41
Advice on Small Claims Process - Bromptonaut

The current excited state of the second hand car market may have distorted the price/expectations thing. It sounds however, based on your mention of intimidation, that this dealer may be well experienced in trying to fend of claims based on sale of dodgy motors.

There's a tool on Citizens Advice website that will help clarify your options:

www.citizensadvice.org.uk/consumer/buying-or-repai.../

The contact us link on the site will give you phone numbers and/or webchat options for consumer specific and general advice. Your local office may have the offer of pro-bono, ie free, legal advice from a solicitors firm.

A word of caution about small claims. Getting a judgment in your favour is one thing; getting it paid is another story.

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Mon 4 Oct 2021 12:42
Advice on Small Claims Process - Gibbo_Wirral

The dealer is not interested so Citizens advice and small claims only way to go.

Are we sure about this? It sounds like the buyer is demanding the dealer go out of their way to collect the car from hundreds of miles away.

If I bought something that was faulty from hundreds of miles away and the seller said "bring it back", I would have to deal with that myself for being daft enough to buy something not local.

We're talking a cheap second hand 207 here, its not like they're rare and you need to travel across the country for one.

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Mon 4 Oct 2021 18:50
Advice on Small Claims Process - Bernardo Kerr

Thanks Brompton and Gibbo for the input. From my understanding of the CRA, it doesn't actually matter how far away I am from the seller; they sold me a car that's meant to be capable of travelling hundreds of miles without breaking down within a couple of days (that's what cars are for, after all). I'm fairly sure that, from this point of view, my reasons for buying it from Kent when I'm now living in Somerset wouldn't be a factor in a court ruling because it wouldn't make any difference whether I live here or 20 miles down the road, when I'd still have to pay for a tow truck to take it over to the garage.

But then that's what I'm here to get your legal perspectives on. So, as Gibbo said, are we sure about this? Would a court say that my claim's invalid because I didn't buy from somewhere local but am still pursuing consumer rights legislation?

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Mon 4 Oct 2021 19:15
Advice on Small Claims Process - focussed

Because the trader sold you a car that does not now work it is his responsibility to repair it. If he either ignores you, or refuses to repair it ,you are within you rights to tell him that you will get it repaired and sue him for the cost plus your reasonable expenses in the small claims track of the county court .

It does not matter if the dealer is in John O'Groats and you are in Land's End the law still applies.

"Would a court say that my claim's invalid because I didn't buy from somewhere local"

Which could be easily countered by saying that the dealer should not have sold the car to a person who did not live locally to them.

Do it all by tracked and signed for letters, don't phone him or accept any phone calls from him.

Don't delay - do it today - your 6 months to do this is running out.

Edited by focussed on 04/10/2021 at 19:19

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Mon 4 Oct 2021 19:19
Advice on Small Claims Process - elekie&a/c doctor
As far as I can make out , you have done the right thing . You have informed the the dealer that you are rejecting the car within the 30 day CRA , (right to rejection )as it’s not fit for purpose. It’s also down to the dealer to collect the car at no cost to yourself , whatever the distance . With no response from from the seller, the only option is small claims . Do not spend any money on the car or attempt any repair .
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Mon 4 Oct 2021 20:56
Advice on Small Claims Process - focussed
As far as I can make out , you have done the right thing . You have informed the the dealer that you are rejecting the car within the 30 day CRA , (right to rejection )as it’s not fit for purpose. It’s also down to the dealer to collect the car at no cost to yourself , whatever the distance . With no response from from the seller, the only option is small claims . Do not spend any money on the car or attempt any repair .

Only go down this route if you have some written proof of diagnosis of the failed head gasket such as the receipt from whoever carried out the sniff test, or a copy of a breakdown service or garage report/worksheet etc.

Otherwise it's just your word against the dealer's.

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Tue 5 Oct 2021 12:24
Advice on Small Claims Process - Gibbo_Wirral

Would a court say that my claim's invalid because I didn't buy from somewhere local but am still pursuing consumer rights legislation?

Absolutely not.

What they will ask is if you tried to get the car to the garage? From what I've read you've not done that and its now gone to the threats of legal action stage (to try and get the garage to back down and pick it up?)

Personally I would have done the same when the car broke down - contacted the garage and asked them to collect it.

If they'd refused then I would have just got it to then as soon as possible.

A couple of years ago I bought a car from a garage 50 miles away. The engine light came on and the EGR was faulty. The garage asked me to bring it back and they fixed it. Yes, it was a pain having to go back home via public transport and then back again to collect it, but that was all on me for buying so far away.

According to this page featuring the CRA 2015 it states:

"The dealer’s not liable for where the vehicle broke down"

www.theaa.com/car-buying/legal-rights

If I bought a kettle from Argos that failed, I would be expected to take it back to them for a repair or refund. I wouldn't expect them to come and collect it. I would say the same applies to any car purchase (check the contract) unless they have some really excellent after-sales service.

Edited by Gibbo_Wirral on 05/10/2021 at 12:29

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Tue 5 Oct 2021 20:01
Advice on Small Claims Process - Bernardo Kerr

Thanks for the clarification, focussed, elek and Gibbo. Fortunately, I rejected within the 30 days so I don't have any issues with that, and I do have evidence of the sniff test (filmed and with documentation). From what you're all saying, it sounds like the claim would be seen as valid by the small claims court but that there might be some judges who don't look favourably on the fact that I didn't take it to the garage to give them a chance to fix it. This does seem to be a grey area that's a little open to interpretation because the CRA actually seems slightly contradictory on this, with one bit saying it should be repaired without any considerable inconvenience to the buyer and another bit saying that if I took it off the seller's premises myself then I should return it. Bit confusing when it comes to a car, whereas a kettle from Argos is a bit more cut and dried because it isn't the actual mode of transport used to take the item off the premises and it's not meant to be able to take me back when it starts showing faults!

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