1.2 TSI vs 1.6 CR 105 - Skoda Fabia - advice to a colleague

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Mon 6 Aug 2012 16:33
1.2 TSI vs 1.6 CR 105 - Skoda Fabia - advice to a colleague - pork_pie

Good afternoon folks.

A colleague of mine decided to place an order for a new car and decided to go for an Estate SE plus 1.6 diesel 105 with a few extras. What swayed her was the VAT off deal and the lower tax - she currently owns a 53 plate Fiat JTD 115 and makes occasional trips to the south coast each year.

Her annual mileage is 11k a year and the commute to work involves driving through Liverpool, through the Mersey tunnel into The Wirral.

Her best mate told me all this (another colleague) and I said - right car (she has a dog and needs storage for camping and to tow a trailer) but totally the wrong engine.

The colleague in question had a chat to me today and I explained that with her annual mileage and the type of driving (mainly through town with the odd motorway jaunt) haivng a diesel would be totally unsuitable. I stressed I was not discouraging her from what she has picked but I was adamant that this engine is a duffer.

I asked her "How long are you going to keep it?" About 10 years. I immediately told her about the DPF and DMFs and what they do and how much they cost and how long they last. "But the tax is cheap and it does 67 mpg". I further explained that any tax savings would be gobbled up by maintaining the vehicle and one will not get anywhere near 67mpg - the VED system is based on totally inaccurate data"

I asked her why the dealer did not persuade her to go petrol? She said the dealer made no effort to try anything else. is the dealer trying to offload a model with an engine that no one wants? "But how come my Fiat engine is still running after 9 years?". I told her that diesel engines are getting so complex now that they are prone to going wrong more frequently and dont have this ridiculous Diesel Pariculate FIlters. I told her that I have a 61 plate 1.4 TDCi fiesta and i said to her that I will only use it for motorway driving and it will probably be my last diesel ever. If I want to go to town, i will take the bus.

I suggested shelook at the 1.2 TSI 105 which has slightly less torque but I explained that the turbo will provide the necessary poke and that the price difference will make up the slightly higher tax. She is now thinking about trying the 1.2 this week even though she has already placed an order for the diesel (which of course is not from stock due to her option choices).

What do you people think of 1) The 1.6 engine 2) The TSI and 3) Was I unfair in the advice I gave her?

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Mon 6 Aug 2012 17:12
1.2 TSI vs 1.6 CR 105 - Skoda Fabia - advice to a colleague - TeeCee

11k miles a year, a daily commute in traffic accounting for most of it and only the occasional long trip?

I think your advice is sound, given what we know.

Her planned 10 year use is irrelevant. If she's really that worried about fuel consumption and VED, she'll be changing it sooner. Whichever engine she takes will be in the gas-guzzler tax bracket well before that, as technology will have moved on.

If you're trying to save money by picking the most tax-efficient car, you have to remember that you're playing a game against people who have the goalposts on castors.......

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Mon 6 Aug 2012 17:52
1.2 TSI vs 1.6 CR 105 - Skoda Fabia - advice to a colleague - 72 dudes

I'd also say the advice you gave was good.

The 1.2 TSi is a cracking little engine. I tried one in a Golf and it was very smooth with enough torque for every day driving. Bear in mind this was only the 85 BHP version, so the 105 should be even better.

The sort of driving she does means she will get nowhere near the EU combined figure.

I'd estimate 50 MPG from the 1.6 CRd and between 40 and 45 on the 1.2 TSI.

Factor in the higher price of diesel and as you say possible DPF/EGR troubles and there won't be a huge difference in running costs.

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Mon 6 Aug 2012 18:49
1.2 TSI vs 1.6 CR 105 - Skoda Fabia - advice to a colleague - unthrottled

Scaremongering nonsense.

Funny how when diesel engines develop they are derided as "complex", but when petrol engines develop they are seen as "innovative".

All of you have done is create unnecessary doubt. VW generally don't seem to have had too many problems with their DPFs or DMFs.

EGR valves?! Every petrol car made in the last 15 years has got one.

There's a whole load of crap on modern petrols that diesels don't need-

-Expensive throttle bodies with precision stepper motors

-Variable lift/duration/timing valvetrains

-High intensity ignition system that won't arc under high cylinder pressures

-3 way lambda control

It's very premature to decide that that the TFSI engines will be as durable in service as their predecessors.

11,000 miles p.a is borderline diesel territory, but it certainly isn't a bad purchase.

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Mon 6 Aug 2012 19:55
1.2 TSI vs 1.6 CR 105 - Skoda Fabia - advice to a colleague - madf

My experience of petriol engines in town:

they have no chance of achieving official fuel figures #

the cats die early due to fuel contamination

# and that's the summer. 10% worse in the winter.

Edited by madf on 06/08/2012 at 19:55

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