Thanks everyone.
I have asked our salesman to quote for a V70 2.4T SE in the closest spec we can get to the "S60 2.4T SE + options" already quoted for, and will then make the decision.
I normally find decisions easy, and car buying ones especially so, but this one is proving awkward! I am sure we can 'manage' with my preferred choice of gorgeous S60, but having become accustomed to not having to worry about carry-all space, and with a family hopefully around the corner, it's difficult to argue against the practicalities of a V70.
Stay tuned for the final outcome!
/Steve
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"but it is not often that we carry adults in the rear."
SjB,
I'd have thought this was the key. The rear legroom of the S60 is a bit tight but this is only a problem for adult passengers of tall teenagers.
The boot struck me as pretty big for a saloon.
They both drive well in 2.4T mode with the S60 just having the edge by virtue of the reduced shape/weight and I'd echo people's comments re the desirability of the SE pack.
Good luck.
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I tried out an S60 when choosing my last car and was impressed. Although rear space and boot space aren't huge, they're no worse than most of the competition (3 ser**s, A4, IS200 etc.). Fact is, this sort of thing only matters once or twice a year.
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Hi Peterb,
I think that's where my suprise has come from: Given that the S60 is based on the S80 floorpan, I had previously never understood why all the magazines pitch it against Beemer 3s and A4s, when surely Beemer 5s and A6s were the logical choice.
After all, the V70 has the same basic floorpan and is certainly more of a Beemer 5 Touring than the microscopic con trick that is a 3 Touring, so why not the S60?
May be now I know why!
Incidentally, I have also now learned that (for me and my missus at least), the V70 2.4T SE is significantly cheaper to insure than the S60 2.4T SE, especially with business mileage included.
Argument is now swinging the way of the V70, with I guess the best purchase price I can find being the deciding factor.
BTW, although I tug forelock to HJ's wisdom, and am very happy to be corrected, all sources I find give (within a couple of percent) the same retained value for S60s and V70s, with the better at three years being the S60 in 2.4T SE guise. I still reckon though that at my expected 6 to 8 years, the V70 will be decidedly the better.
Cheers for now,
Steve
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So if one wanted to pick up a lightly used used S60 for 'buttons' where should one go?
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So now we have the deal, in nearest round numbers:
S60 2.4T SE nicely loaded except satnav: £23500.
UK equivalent spec at list price: £28000
Saving: £4500, and also well under UK list for the basic SE with no options.
V70 2.4T SE equivalently loaded: £27000
UK equivalent at list price: £32000
Saving: £5000, and also well under UK list for the basic SE with no options.
Both include all export paperwork and a full tank of fuel, and I hope to time collection with a legitimate business trip, so incurr no collection cost.
Unfortunately, £27000 for the V70 is over budget, so by stripping off all non SE options except lowered self levelling chassis, pearlescent paint, and laminated glass, which remain, it comes down to £24,500 (UK equivalent spec £29100 = saving £4600). This is even £3160 below UK list for the basic SE with no options.
Would sensible thinking confirm that £24,500 for a V70 2.4T SE plus the options listed above, is a better long term bet than £23,500 for a very well loaded S60 2.4T SE, remembering I will keep whichever gets the nod for at least six years?
/Steve
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Hard to say by how much, but yes.
Parkers reckons that, at 5 years and 60k, a V70 T5 SE is worth over £2,000 more than the equivalent S70.
I appreciate that the S60 is a lot sexier than the S70, but there will still be a discrepancy. Options are never worth what you pay for them, although a car like this will be unsaleable without metallic, leather, air and alloys.
Unless you're planning to run the car into the ground, for 10 years or more, there will be a noticeable difference in the cars' value when it's time to change. Given the extra practicality of the V70, I'd go for that every time and not worry too much about the options.
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Might be worth giving a UK car broker a call to see what their best price is....
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Decision made.
I have just ordered a 2003 V70 2.4T to full UK SE specification, plus sports full leather seats instead of standard, lowered suspension with self levelling, pearlescent paint, heated front seats, rear spoiler, Dolby surround upgrade, and a whole load more, for £25,200 OTR, all UK taxes paid. Car comes with free high quality floor mats, a full tank of fuel, and all export paperwork completed, including Dutch transit plates.
UK list for the basic SE is £27660 0TR, which with the options chosen rises to almost exactly £31,000 OTR.
Saving is therefore £5800 for the price of a few hours of my time in the evenings, plus an extra three hours detour & showroom time when we were on holiday in the viscinity of the Dutch dealer anyway.
Having been stuck at £26,500 last night, when my ceiling was £25,000 the clincher was my demonstration of faith in transferring a 35% deposit when 30% was asked for, before we had actually agreed the £25,200. Far from having my trousers taken down, this was perceived as I hoped as a demonstration of seriousness.
Delivery is still scheduled at 8-10 weeks, despite bad news from the North Sea a few days ago, and the resultant 'reorders' that will result. BTW the Dutch dealer believes that most of the lost Volvos were destined for North America, not the UK.
The icing on the cake was the fantastic way I was treated, and the complete transparency of negotiation. No Pendle technique here, with the frame of mind being "I need you to save me money, but I also need you to still be here in six years time so you need to make a profit."
So, a reasonably loaded Maya Yellow S60 2.4T SE became a highly loaded V70 2.4T SE for an additional £1200 based on the final S60 price / spec we got to.
Good luck to anyone else who goes down the same route, and thank you Backroomers for your help and advice.
/Steve
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Sure, HJ. If all goes to plan, I'll send a conclusion.
One strange aspect of the deal that I forgot to mention yesterday: During negotiations to reduce the price, I reluctantly agreed to dispense with the sports leather seats, as these come as part of an expensive options pack for cars ordered in the Netherlands. In the event, it was only possible to give me the purchase price I was asking for by INCLUDING the sports seats. A perfect result! I guess that this is because of some strange bonus calculation, or greater discount potential on options rather than the base vehicle.
One final thing to say for anyone else contemplating a personal import: The best thing I did was to download and print the PDF file from the Volvo UK website that contained the precise SE specification, and the cost of every option.
Given that Dutch Volvos seem to be completely built up with option packs, rather than having a couple of different basic specs to start from as we do, it was then very easy to sit down with the salesman, and in the space of five minutes ensure that I really did have a full UK SE model. This was down to the last glitch grommet, plus my extra desires, and some unexpected 'freebies' that came as a side effect of the Dutch option packs. All of these 'freebies' exist in the UK options list, they are all nice to have (though by no means essential), but they would all otherwise have cost extra money.
Stay tuned for the final chapter.
/Steve
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Sounds like a great deal. I test drove a pretty basic V70 2.4T today, with a forecort price of £24k - a year old and 8k on the clock.
Cracking engine, smooth, progressive, with loads of power. Tried an A6 3.0 later in the day and it was not nice at all - very twitchy. Felt like driving an engine with bad turbo lag!
Nice drive but down a country lane it was all over the place. It was a poor road but very disturbing. I need to try out a model with the "sports suspension" to see if that improves matters. I have the sports suspension on my 98R S40 and it is as hard as a rock.
If I like the drive and cannot get a good deal I am thinking of importing new - I need to PX my S40, but if necessary will sell privately.
Any details you could provide on the dealer, the final spec you ordered and the price would be great. Let me know if you can e-mail these and I'll post my email.
I assume there are no problems with warranties now.
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The final chapter.
I promised to write when I collected my V70 2.4T from the supplying Dutch dealer. This I have now done, and report top service.
The (factory order) car was ready after only four weeks versus the eight to ten anticipated, but the dealer happily held it for me until the date I actually wanted it. Customer care all along was of the highest order, and it was a genuine pleasure to spend the money. The only error was the 2.4T badge on the back, when I had specified badge delete. Without question, this was carefully removed whilst I drank a cup of coffee, and you'd never know it had been there.
Although the dealer only asked for 30% deposit, I am glad I saw the start of the Sterling slide and paid the remainder shortly after, or the saving would have been reduced. In the end (I am still waiting for the VAT claim to arrive) I guess that I will pay approximately £26500 for a motor that lists at £31000 in the UK.
Apart from a great weekend away, the other icing on the cake was the salesman remembering a chance conversation early in the process when he learned that I collect quality model cars: Along with some bottles of fine wine, presented along with my keys was a superb model replica of the car I had just purchased, correct down to colour and wheels. Perhaps a minor point, when really it was the Big V70 that was important, but appreciated greatly none the less, and nice attention to detail.
Oh yes.
The dealer.
Bluekens of Breda.
+31 765 22 33 44
And the car?
So glad I listened to the advice to buy the 2.4T power unit and not the T5. Effortlessly torquey, it is exactly what I hoped for.
I also think that rain sensors should be law!
After 300 wet miles home, without once having to adjust wiper speed, even when truck wheels delivered sudden deluges, it is the best 80 Euros I've ever spent.
The Dolby surround system upgrade cost rather more, but is truly awesome! :-))
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