Just mulling over the merits of the japanese diesels, and wondered peoples thoughts.....
Avensis - seems to be several different bhp of engine - are there differently priced options, or a series of updated engines fitted over time.
My price range is prob the early current-shape avensis diesel - 110bhp it seems, is that enough or is the car underpowered ? What other (better ? ) engines are there ?
Can the early current shape engine be "chipped" to produce better performance ? What about the other engines ? WHat are insurance Co. attitudes to this - what approx is the price premium increase, and do they require some kindof engineers report to verify the Bhp of the mods ?
IF I was feeling flush might think about the accord 2.2 diesel - but reports on Car-by-car breakdown of high oil consumptiuon and poor mpg - what do owners find here ???
What are the likely probs of these modern diesels as they get older and the miles go on - I know earlier diesels were simple things, hence little to go wrong, but will these high-tech engines be "pig" once the yget older, and cease to be worth repairing - Hence should one really be buying a higher miler car, as many of these diesels will be, or will one be in for a big bill over 120Kmiles say ?
Thanks for peoples knowledge - as always good on this site !
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My Accord diesel does around 42MPG pottering around and has not used any oil since 8000 miles (now at 17000 miles). Tramlining has disappeared since changing to Michelin Pilot Sport tyres (original Yokos only lasted 8000 miles!! Michelins done 9000 miles and still looking good).
I must admit I was disappointed with the fuel economy when it was new (low to mid 30's) and yes it did use a little oil at first. Make sure you give it some revs quite often and it seems to run in perfectly.
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My Accord had poor fuel consumption until about 8,000 miles. It also used a bit of oil. However, it's now coming up to 15,000 miles and it hasn't used any oil since it's last service ,and fuel consumption varies from about 38mpg to 51 mpg depending on usage.
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Thanks for the info on the accords...
Anyone got any info on the AVENSIS ?? Just for comparison ?
Thanks !!
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My Avensis is petrol; best bet for you would be to have a look through the Toyotaowners forum. You will find a separate Avensis section .
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I don't have any first hand knowledge on either car, but for what it's worth 110 bhp doesn't sound like much to haul a family saloon / hatchback around with.
MTC
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.... but for what it's worth 110 bhp doesn't sound like much to haul a family saloon / hatchback around with.
True but it's the high torque of these diesel engines that makes them suitable for medium/large cars.
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I have the 110bhp D4D in the older shaped Avensis. I use it solely for commuting to work and back around 30,000 miles. Not a particulary exciting engine, but does the job.
If I were in your position, I would consider
a: Do you really need a diesel (do your calculations thoroughly)
b: Do you really need a diesel (do your calculations again)
c: Test drive the petrol and 2.0 diesel and 2.2 diesel.
I get roughly 48mpg in my Avensis. I would probably get around 38mpg in a petrol.
Diesels have high pressure fuel pumps, dual mass flywheels, direct injection. All these cost £000's if they go wrong. Make sure you take these into account as one broken fuel pump can eradicate all the savings you would make on a diesel economy.
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I have the 110bhp D4D in the older shaped Avensis. I use it solely for commuting to work and back around 30,000 miles. Not a particulary exciting engine, but does the job. If I were in your position, I would consider a: Do you really need a diesel (do your calculations thoroughly) b: Do you really need a diesel (do your calculations again) c: Test drive the petrol and 2.0 diesel and 2.2 diesel. I get roughly 48mpg in my Avensis. I would probably get around 38mpg in a petrol. Diesels have high pressure fuel pumps, dual mass flywheels, direct injection. All these cost £000's if they go wrong. Make sure you take these into account as one broken fuel pump can eradicate all the savings you would make on a diesel economy.
Out of interest does the vectra c 03 2.0Dti have a duel mass flywheel, i know the later 1.9cdti's do, just not sure whether the "old" dti's do.
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Out of interest does the vectra c 03 2.0Dti have a duel mass flywheel
Yep. As per the previous reply to the question when you were called prm ;o)
www.honestjohn.co.uk/forum/post/index.htm?v=e&t=38...6
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Sorry DD, mmissed that one, as always a mine of VX information.
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>> .... but for what it's worth 110 bhp doesn't sound like much to haul a family saloon / hatchback around with. True but it's the high torque of these diesel engines that makes them suitable for medium/large cars.
I wrote this because my previous car was a 116 bhp Rover 75 diesel and while the engine was very smooth, quiet and refined, it was only when it had been chipped up to 130 bhp taht it became obvious about the lack of urgency on the performance front.
The torque figures for the Avensis and Rover 75 are nigh on identical.
MTC
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Just to put the other side of the Accord case again - mine has averaged 50mpg over 77000 miles. Uses no oil between services.
Front tyres last around 30-32k and rears 50k - Pilot Premacies.
8k on a set of tyres - no wonder he is only getting 42 MPG ! ! ! ! ! ! !
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8K was on the Yoko tyres that were fitted by Honda of which I thought were absolute rubbish. Even the dealer thought I must have been driving around like a nutter to wear them out so fast! (I am middle-aged plodder, but a very good loooking one mind :)) The vectra I had previous did 28000 on Michelin Pilots and they weren't too bad when I sold it so I don't think it is my driving style.
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Hi
Yes, I could do with a diesel - we have a holiday home in N. Wales and I live in SW London, and often have weekends there, with plenty of driving around when I am there, always costs an absolute fortune in petrol at the moment.
My sister has a 115bhp Seat Alhambra, seems to go OK,and I am sure that is quite heavy.....
Anyone with any experience of "chipping" the Avensis D-4D engine ? what kind of BHP and TOrque increase can be got out of it ?
Would also like to borrow my sisters caravan, which she tows at the moment with the Seat alhambra (says it tows it very well)
Anyone had any experience towing with the Avensis, or with the Accord for that matter ?
Cheers !
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I thought about towing with the Accord this year but when I looked at getting a detachable towing bracket I would need to have the rear bumper cut to accomodate it. [70mm x 70mm]. So I bottled out and hired a Mitsubishi L200 Warrior - Superb tow vehicle. I read an article (I think from the caravan Club) and they rated the Accord very well on their tests.
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I don't want to offend or pick a fight but how can a saloon with 110bhp feel underpowered? Is it just drivers expectations? For years I drove a 1.7D Astra MkII van all over Britain mostly loaded up and ladders on the roof. Yes it was less exciting than it could have been but it could certainly lose you your licence if you wanted too. I just think that with all the speed cameras powerful motors are a liability. I just find it baffling, to me it's the same as most people won't consider an electric car because it's range is limited, how many car journeys are over 50 miles a day? For tooling around, shopping, school run, etc. they'd be ideal. Shame about the EV1.
Steve.
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Xantia HDi.
Buy a Citroen and get to know the local GSF staff better...
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I don't want to offend or pick a fight but how can a saloon with 110bhp feel underpowered?
Hi Steve,.
No offense taken or cudgels lifted
I used the example of how much better my 116 bhp Rover was when it had been chipped upto 130 bhp - it was just improved in every way !! & the Rover was quite a heavy old bus.
Mabye it is like when 4 speed gearboxes were being replaced with 5 speeds - people said the why do we need 5 when 4 have always been OK ?
MTC
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Steve, I know exactly what you mean, but I do have to disagree. My sister has a 1.9 non-turbo 206, and it's fine for everyday driving. Except. When you try to pull out onto a busy road, or overtake, you realise that there's nothing left. At all. I nearly got rear-ended by something on the A46 in Cov - I'd simply not appreciated that I'd been driving it nearly flat out. A 17 second (or something like that) 0-60 apparently correlates quite nicely with my usual relaxed driving style.
I drive a 140 HP Accord diesel. I don't use the power most of the time, but it's very good to have. Overtaking effortlessly and quickly (and therefore safely) is very easy. I feel that this is well worth it. Necessary? Probably not, but it feels justifiable to me.
Gord.
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