|
Apologies re the looks of the Tucson. I had the TerribleToucan (Terracan) in mind. I just had a look at Honestjohn's writeup on the Tucson and it is rather nice..... but a squizz round on google shows the boot volume to be tiny when compared to the Sorento, so still off the list.
|
|
No one appears (but I've only skmimmed) to have mentioned the Toyota Landcruiser (03-) I've seen a couple of these by us lately, I quite like the styling and they seem to have quite a devilish turn-of-speed.
|
|
The Landcruiser would fit the bill, but it's right at the top of the money I want to spend, coming in at £32k by the time I've got a 5-door LC4 with leather. Is it really £12k better than a Sorento? That £12k buys me and the family a whole lot of toys.
|
|
I'd look to get one second-hand, probably a year old so I had peace-of-mind with a 2-year warranty, which ought to bring the price down to about £23k, I'd have thought...also when you come to sell it on, you won't lose as much as you would on a new car.
|
|
|
|
Why on earth would you want to lug a 4x4 on long distances,I brought a New Disco from Austria to the UK for someone and it did my head in.Much better to get a nice Merc estate.And the reason Kia appear cheap is because they are cheap,cheap labour,redundant old DB parts and throw them away at five years old when the gaurantee runs out to my mind they are very expensive.Say what you like about MLs but they are quiet and drive well and hold their price for many years.But if you want so much room and comfort a Citroen C8 would take some beating
|
Why on earth would you want to lug a 4x4 on long distances
With leather, cruise, climate and a decent CD player I can sit at 82mph on the Autoroutes all day long in a well specced 4x4 and get out grinning.
A Merc estate hasn't got 4wd. I've already mentioned that this is a plus given the sports and activities I involve myself in and the potential for a new hobby (green-laning).
Citroen C8? Please! I said I wanted something with car-park appeal, not to look like a taxi driver!
|
Re Citroen C8,
No disrespect but a Kia has about as much street cred as a secondhand Netto carrier bag(no disrespect to Netto)
|
Re Citroen C8, No disrespect but a Kia has about as much street cred as a secondhand Netto carrier bag(no disrespect to Netto)
The C8 is the cab of choice round our way. If it's not the C8 it's the Pug or Fiat derivative. Take the badge off and it will still look like a taxi to anyone in my neck of the woods. I don't have a problem with Citroens, just the C8. MPVs in general, if I'm honest. Not my cup of tea and not up the job I have in mind for it.
The Sorento. Take the badge off and you have a pleasant cross between a Lexus RX and a Merc ML, with all the toys and none of the cost.
Hope that explains things a little better for you. If not, try reading why I want a SUV and then ask yourself if the suggestion of a C8 was ever going to make the grade.
$$
|
The annual tests which they have in Austria for nearly all new 4x4s.One test is driveng up a ski slope ,another across snow laden fields etc the Kia came second to last this place being taken by the Grand Cherokee V8 the Bmw came first and the Lexus second and the MB third.The Kia is a definite soft roader .I agree the C8 will not do what you ask but neither will a Kia.
|
The annual tests which they have in Austria for nearly all new 4x4s.One test is driveng up a ski slope ,another across snow laden fields etc the Kia came second to last this place being taken by the Grand Cherokee V8 the Bmw came first and the Lexus second and the MB third.The Kia is a definite soft roader .I agree the C8 will not do what you ask but neither will a Kia.
Interesting. I wasn't aware of that. I'll have a look around to see what I can find.
|
Interesting what you turn up when you start looking for comparative reviews:
JEEP® GRAND CHEROKEE VOTED THE WORLD?S BEST OFF-ROADER
17 Jun 2004
In a unique shootout between 10 of the UK?s favourite five-door off-roaders, 4x4 magazine has voted the Jeep® Grand Cherokee its ?World?s Best Off-Roader?.
In a series of tests ? each designed to put every vehicle through real off-road situations ? the 2.7 CRD Grand Cherokee was awarded 193 points out of a possible 250.
John Carroll, editor of 4x4 magazine, said: "This test wasn?t about just driving the vehicles through the biggest mud-hole we could find. With a spirit-level, protractor and tape measure, it was about measuring their competence in a true off-road environment.
"Our judges felt that Jeep?s Grand Cherokee stood out as being the most capable, this-will-go-anywhere vehicle. The Jeep?s coil-spring suspension and Quadra-Drive system puts the Grand Cherokee in a different off-road league to the others and makes it a worthy holder of the title of World?s Best Off-Roader."
Vehicle
Points
1
Jeep Grand Cherokee
193
2
Toyota Land Cruiser
184
3
Nissan Terrano
166
4
Nissan Patrol
162
5
Mitsubishi Shogun
160
6
Land Rover Discovery
157
7
Hyundai Terracan
144
8
Kia Sorento
143
9
Mercedes-Benz ML
130
10
BMW X5
105
The 10 tests looked at key off-road criteria such as suspension flexibility and approach and departure angles, as well as ground clearance and axle articulation. The testing also included real world tests with each car completing a hillclimb and obstacle courses.
Simon Elliott, Managing Director of the Chrysler Group in the UK, said: "We are delighted that 4x4 magazine has awarded the Grand Cherokee the coveted title of the World's Best Off-Roader. At home in the city or the country the Grand Cherokee is exceptional in every way. The expert panel of judges from the UK's top off-roading magazine has certainly proved that the Grand Cherokee is king of 4x4s."
Which is pretty much the reverse of the Austrian test mentioned above. Now the Sorento hasn't scored brilliantly, but its above an X5 and ML and only just behind the Disco. That would be fine with me.
|
|
|
|
"X-Trail is a possible, but again it just doesn't stare me in the face and say "you'll be proud to have me in your driveway". I've driven one and it struck me as being an Almera on a step ladder, just a mediocre car sat a bit too high. With the Sorento you feel you are in a substantial 4x4 and that changes my expectations and the way I drive. Daft, but true."
Remember that the Nissan X-Trail is a much more sophisticated vehicle (from an engineering perspective) than the Sorrento. The Sorrento is actually quite crudely engineered - it has a beam rear axle and an old-fashioned ladder chassis which doesn't have the torsional stiffness of a monocoque design. This gives it clunky handling, particularly on a bumpy road. Also, if you look underneath a Sorrento you'll see that the chassis is not particularly elegantly engineered - there are all sorts of bits of brackets welded 'here and there' to try to stiffen it up.
Also, in your deliberations, don't forget that Hyundai and Kia are essentially the same company, but Hyundai give you a five-year warranty whereas Kia (correct me if I'm wrong) only give three years.
|
You have to admit. You would look like a super cool dude in a Landcruiser.
--
Adam
|
>>You would look like a super cool dude in a Landcruiser.
He's right you know.
|
|
|
Hello Adski.
The Landcruiser idea is appealing but I want a new car! I'm going to jump up and down and stamp my feet now because you've given me an alternative that really appeals on every level except being new. Going to have to give this some further consideration.
Aprilia, I understand what you are saying from an engineering perspective but the reality was I found the X-trail to be a less pleasant driving experience, possibly because I treated it as a car rather than a 2t pile of steel on wheels. Good point about the Hyundai warranty though. If I go down the Kia route I'll be having a discussion about that with the dealer.
I think I'm going to have a root around on Autotrader for used Landcruisers.
|
Well. I think you should get a LC because
a) Mark has one
b) One steamed past me the other day. It was a 4.0 in black and it looked gorgeous. Yes - that's right. I'm saying a love how a 4x4 looks.
c) Short of an X5 and RR (which I will agree - are a bit too footballer's wives nowadays) I think it's the nicest looking 4x4 on the market.
d) Mark has one
I was sitting in one belonging to a certain ex-Everton player. Full leather, every toy you could imagine. And I wanted one.
At least have a play in one and see what you think - new or not.
--
Adam
|
>>Well. I think you should get a LC because...
....you desperately try to copy my lifestyle due to your intense admiration of me.
In all seriousness, the Landcruiser is great and I love it to bits. Also, as Adski said, it has every toy you can imagine.
But, it is brutally expensive to run (fuel) and maintain (servicing). The price of tyres is enough to make you weep, although fortunately it doesn't get through them that fast but it eats brakes. So much so that I cannot imagine having one if a) you didn't intend to use its capabilities fairly often and b) you didn't have a reasonable amount of money to throw at it.
I am not a fast driver, but it is much slower than a car around country lanes. Even hacking down the motorway you have to remember that it takes quite a long time to stop. It doesn't handle or stop the way a car does. Therefore you need to keep your distance from stuff, and idiots keep pulling into the space in front of you. It is big, so you do have to be careful and sometimes car parks are a nusiance.
The diesel is cheaper to run, but I find the engine somewhat agricultural. Of course, I think diesel engines are rotten, so I might be biased against them.
I'd think carefully before getting something quite so big, if I were you.
Mind you, it is a lot of fun in London making even the most idiotic of bus drivers or taxi drivers behave. It is nice driving in the countryside since you are high up and you can see a lot more both in front (driver) and all around (pasengers). It carries 8 people - in comfort if two of them are children. The middle seats in the second and third rows have limited leg room.
Its very comfortable with the driver, everything in the car is easily visible and reachable, plenty of space. Mind you, I used to use the Omega Estate for moving loads of stuff because it could carry more, so don't get excited about how much luggage room you have.
Of course it can tow just about anything. I've had it resting on its chassis in soft mud and it will still pull itself out. I've wimped out with it, but it never has - I have had a Landcruiser in the most insane positions in the Andes, and they never fail - I just don't see you needing that capability on the south coast !
|
|
Pretty much sums it up. LC is more of a beast than I need. Strike that one, back to the Sorento and a possible look at the Shogun.
|
|
One final addition I'd like to put forward...the Honda CRV CDT-i. Now it's only half an inch smaller than a Sorento, so should have similar load-lugging abilities...BUT it's got that highly-rated diesel, AND I bet if you asked nicely you could get them to throw in the "Hate Something, Change Something" song on a CD...Ok, it might not be the ultimate in off-road go anywhere ability, but I'm sure it'll cope admirably in the snowy ski-resorts of the Alps. Or for the more elegant gentleman, a used Audi Allroad...
|
Honda boot is a fair bit smaller than that on the Sorento. I wasn't impressed with the Allroad I tried, especially it's low 20s fuel economy from the diesel! That said, my needs are more focussed now than they were then, so I will revisit that one. Still wanna new car though(sulk).
Disco 2 is, well, a bit of a boat. Disco 3 is too pricey at the spec I would like and is huuuuge. Same reservations that apply to the LC apply.
Hmmmm. Allroad. Time I had another look.
|
|
|
|
I'm following this thread with interest because I have been looking at the same contenders. Like $till $kint I was underwhelmed by the X-Trail (and the Freelander) and whilst tempted by the Forester it's too car like for me.
I think that the comments above about the Landcruiser probably apply to the Shogun too. HJ's comment in the CBCB about it being Europe's most stolen unrecovered vehicle was enough to put me off.
I like the look of the Sorento however I suspect that residuals will collapse in the next year or so - I think most are bought privately on finance so there won't be many available until those agreements end.
You might want to look at the Nissan Pathfinder which has picked up some good reviews and undercuts the XC90. Also the Kia Sportage shares the Sorento's looks and is almost as roomy. The Grand Vitara is certainly not car-like and there will be deals available because a new model is on the way. Finally, the RX300 offers the elevated driving position with good road manners.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
