A bit out of the way, but I suspect someone here will have something to say..
What is the considered opinion of buying a 1990 Testarossa with 20,000 miles on the clock for 47,000 pounds ?
Given that question, what further comments arise given that I would be putting 8k-10k miles on it a year as I would be driving it regularily.
I am not looking to buy this car as an investment, it would be my normal car and therefore subject to the elements.
Originally I was looking at a new, or at least newer, Ferrari but since everybody said that with more than 3000 miles p.a. they become unsellable I had given up on the idea as being too stupid and costly. Not only do I have no interest in buying a car which I can't use, the price of the newer models is totally ridiculous.
However, buying an older one is firstly more affordable and secondly I am not likely to spoil it by simple putting miles on it. Whilst I am not intending to sell it again in the forseeable future, neither do I want it to be worthless.
Which also leads to the point that if I put 8000 miles a year on it, it will be, within two years, a *very* high mileage Ferrari. Again, not from a value point of view, but from a maintenance and reliability point, what impact would this have ?
Especially since I would hazard a guess on owning it for 4 or 5 years.
Added to that, a Testarossa, which to be fair I have only ever driven once, seems to be inordinately cheap when compared to other models, even though I've always believed it to be a good car. Is it ?
I haven't got a particular car in mind at this minute, but an 89/90 seems to run between 45k & 50k pounds.
If you can point me to a good site, all well and good. But most of them have somewhat of an irritating and superior attitude and seem to regard these cars as works of art, rather than something to be driven and enjoyed. And certainly they don't do well offering advice as to the actual, practical use of such a thing although they can all tell you how to store it in the best way !
M.
p.s. this would be for use in the UK when I return next spring.
p.p.s. No, David, I do not want a Citroen nor, Guy, do I want a VW.
p.p.s. and now you know what it costs to make me work in Brazil !
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A long time ago I did have a neighbour who tried to use a Ferrari for day to day transport. He gave up, mainly because if he got stuck in traffic it started to run rough and needed (an impractical) good blast to clear. Sorry I'm a bit vague on details but the conclusion was it wasn't suited as regular urban transport. He swapped it for SL Mercedes.
PS I thought the virtue of the Honda NSX was that it was Ferrari like, but suitable for regular use!
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Mark
At least now we have an answer to my comments in "Weekend Driver" as you admit in p.p.s.
If you want it, can afford it, buy it and use it.
My Honda Blackbird has done nearly 30,000 miles in the 28 months I have owned it. The bike shop I bought it from say at every service "but most people only do 3000 per year sell it before its worth nothing" My comment is you get more out of me in servicing charges and I like the bike and want to use it. As an engineer I hate to see any machinery not used as it should be. I totally admire the vintage racing boys who use irreplacable equipment as it was intended.
BUY IT USE IT AND TELL US HOW GOOD IT IS!!!
Bill
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Mark
I would agree with Bill, go for it!
If you've got the opportunity why not take it, after all you will only find the pitfalls in running it every day by doing it and I would suggest that you would soon find out one way or the other. If you decide it's not practical I would think you won't have put enough mileage on it by then to affect the value greatly.
At least you will have had some fun finding out!!!
Cockle
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Mark
At the risk of being merely anecdotal, here's my tuppenceworth. My local paper has an 18,ooo mile Testarossa (1986 model) advertised by a garage at £39,995 so your ballpark figures seems right.
My understanding from brief conversation with one owner, and gleaned from motoring press, is that it is probably not the best Ferrari for everyday frequent use. Depends on what you are familiar with I guess. Main reasons are heavy clutch in traffic and width under UK conditions.
Are Ferraris reliable? I think the Americans have more experience with high mileage supercars--nice interstates with no bends. There is a book by an American author on how to service your own Ferrari. Even if you don't want to do that, it is worth reading because it discusses longevity and regular use of the smaller V8 models. If you are interested I will hunt for my lost copy.
Lastly, when I considered doing something similar while I was in the Middle East, I was interested in a more mundane Mondial. I was recommended to seek advice from a Ferrari specialist and pointed in the direction of Mortimer Houghton Turner in the Cotswolds for service and advice on running costs. I went vintage in the end and didn't pursue the Ferrari so can't vouch for the recomendation. They are on www.mhtferrari.co.uk
Yet more lastly, haven't seen any really high mileage Ferraris offered but I did see a Lancia 8.32 advertised the other week with the Ferrari engine and 100K on the clock.
David
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> Main reasons are heavy clutch in traffic and width under UK conditions.
The one I drove had a heavy clutch, but it wasn't *that* bad. However, it certainly is a wide car.
>If you are interested I will hunt for my lost copy.
Oh, yes please. Even if you can't find it, if you could remember the author or title I would probably be able to track it down, assuming its in print.
Not that there is ANY chance of me servicing it myself.
Thanks for the website & co. mention.
Mark.
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Mark,
Sorry, singularly failed to find the book but as this is a long-term project will let you know when it turns up. It was remaindered when I bought it and isn't on the Amazon site. Book was written by an independent US Ferrari repairman and concentrated on the V8s of which he had most experience (in the early 90s?). The gist of it was that those engines, at least, with regular maintenance and preventive action were capable of being long-lived at a price. I felt more confident about the reality of running a V8 after reading it.
ferrariclubofamerica.org have a tech inquiry person. Don't know about the UK owners' club.
David
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Bill's Blackbird is considerably quicker and hugely more practical than a Testarossa as a daily driver. Where I live, the rich folks take their kids to school in Ferraris (you sometimes see two amongst the Shoguns and Jeeps in the same traffic jam). It certainly makes sense to use the car rather than simply park it in the garage. They need new timing belts (yeah, Ferraris have belts) every two years or every 12,000 miles whatever, and that's usually a £1,500 job. Mark should check things out with DK engineering before he commits. (DK are independent Ferrari servicing and fixing people.) If he's got the money (real money) there's no substitute for the upcomong, power uprated 550 Maranello. Or even a two year old current model 550. But if he wants value and practicality he should go for a Maserati 3200GT. They do 175mph, sound wonderful and have four seats.
HJ
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>>If he's got the money (real money) there's no substitute for the upcomong, power uprated 550 Maranello. Or even a two year old current model 550.
He does. Sadly he also has a real wife who for some reason believes she has something to say about how said money is spent despite the fact that it is his fingers that are worn to the bone slaving over a hot desk in the tropics to earn it whilst she swans around relaxing on beaches ! (she reads the backroom, I am going to get hit so hard for that).
Therefore, if he wishes to keep all of his body parts, and with a Vet for a wife you have to think about these things, he will restrict his spending to 50,000 pounds.
>should go for a Maserati 3200GT. They do 175mph, sound wonderful and have four seats.
Mmm, Trouble is I have always wanted a Ferrari and a long time ago promised myself I would have one when I returned to the UK. Also, isn't that Maserati the one that looks like a saloon car ? A good one, I know, but still a bit saloon car-ish. Perhaps not quite "in you face" enough. Also, 175mph sounds fun, but when ?
There is also David's point about a Porsche, which I have thought about a lot. I think it will come down to whether or not I can convince myself (& swmbo) of the possibility of driving a Ferrari and putting a lot of miles on it with regular driving, then I will probably do that.
On the other hand, if that turns out to be too silly or impractical, then it may be a Porsche.
I have a parts & labour list, which is helping. But its is being very difficult to find out whether the car will just generally deteriorate and become unreliable. Its also difficult to work out how I would get on with it when I was commuting, for example.
I am now thinking of renting one for a few days since I am coming over for a week or so, which is stupidly expensive but not so expensive as spending this sort of money unwisely.
I don't like the Viper or the other American Muscle cars, and I've had some - loads of power - no class.
M.
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Mark said........I am now thinking of renting one for a few days since I am coming over for a week or so, which is stupidly expensive but not so expensive as spending this sort of money unwisely....
Father in Law is over with us this weekend so I'll warn him, tell us the hire car colour and he'll give you a wave in the High Street.
Flat cap, mad pensioner on a mountain bike, Racing Post tucked under his arm. You could set your clock by his trip to Jelfs paper shop each day!
David
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David Woollard wrote:
> Father in Law is over with us this weekend
> Flat cap, mad pensioner on a mountain bike, Racing Post
> tucked under his arm.
...But what's your father like David? ;-)
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check car mags, like top marques, classic and sport car, and you can order a mag called 'ferrari' its about £7 per month but it has loads of ferrari's in, you can get 'ferrari' from any newsagent but only on an order, also get in touch with the ferrari club, details for the club might be on this website, or in the back pages of 'practical classics' magazine.
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There must be something in the air! Thomas Toyota is going to a new home on Saturday to make room in the garage for a last fling. It will only be a Jap import, I fear, and I couldn't even manage that after a misspent life in a nationalised industry, but sometimes the missus is good to me.
I take it, Mark, you did not spend a decade or so in your younger days talking cars, while those who did not want them were making money and could get them!
So I can only say get it, enjoy it and give it a pat from me. Just find a good electrical man, and if it fluffs in traffic, softer plugs.
As a totally impossible dream I 'd have an F40!
Cheers from Tomo
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Mark ,A ferrari nearly bankrupted a good friend of mine to many problems to list .But if you want a bargain super car go for a corvette c5 LSI:With a little bit of tuning they will hit 195mph.
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Mark, what a dilemma! Ferraris are not meant to be practical, they are to give you immense pleasure, and to lust over. Buy it. If you want a fast practical boring looking car, I had a Lotus Carlton, (Company car, not my money) It went like the clappers, was totally reliable, and people in GTi's pulled alongside at the lights.......
Regards, and green with envy,
Mike
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Mark,
Ferrari indeed! Hope not to see you in the Evesham Journal next Spring for 150MPH on the Broadway by-pass! And will it go between the walls to The Mount car park?
I would like to seee you in a sensible Citroen TD, very character building, but I know there's little chance. You will know this (Ferrari) type of car is outside my experience but a couple of comments from someone who sees one now and again and has a lifetime of car interests.
If you want to use such a car why not something a little less "obvious" and suitable for everyday driving like a Porsche. The Ferrari strikes me as too wide, too fragile and out of place on most UK roads. You are likely to get as much undesireable envy as admiration. The attitude of dealers and owners you mention would make me want to avoid their "club". The servicing requirements HJ mentions are quite onerous.
What are you going to get for an actual everyday car then? You'll do more than 8000 a year in the UK surely.
David
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Mark
I'm not familiar with the Testarossa, is it front or mid engine?
My eldest son works with a chap who runs a Ferrari in Bristol, but not quite as an everyday car. I'm sorry I don't know the model but it is about the same age you quote.
His main concern seems to be the cost of maintenance and the frequency that some things are needed on servicing schedules. Things like cam belts, for example, have to be replaced more frequently than "normal cars" and, on his model, is very costly in labour. On some Ferraris a cam belt change is an engine out job - and I believe that access to spark plugs can be difficult too.
For this reason it's worth finding a good independent garage for servicing, as the service history has a huge impact on its saleability.
Ian
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Mark, give Nick Cartwright of Specialist Cars a call. He has specialised in Ferraris for over 25 years, restoring, servicing and buying/selling. I have known Nick for a long time and if I am ever in your position, this is the guy I would trust. The guy is fanatical about his cars and a real perfectionist. You will find him in the UK on 01629 56999. Happy shopping you lucky ***.
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Mark,
Repeat after me ... "A s t o n M a r t i n".
S
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Repeat after me "c h e a p f o r d c r a p"
They look good, but are not good cars. Even the locks are the same as those on a fiesta.
Jon
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Jon,
Shame on you, you have no soul :o)
S.
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Agreed Stu,
I can only reach out to the past for a link here....friend of Dad's had a few....one was a metallic purple DB6.
That was considered ultra "groovy" at the time!
David
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Ok, ok
The old ones were (are) very good cars, but the DB7s, are not (i know people who do body work on them, and they berate them like nothing else). The point I was trying to make, was that they are meant to be ultimate sports cars, but with lots of shared components with very basic models. Still I wouldn't say no to one.
Jon
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>>I take it, Mark, you did not spend a decade or so in your younger days talking cars, while those who did not want them were making money and could get them!
I did, but I was talking about how much better my Hillman Hunter was than my beaten up Toledo and how nobody should have a mini with the external door hinges or how to replace a headgasket on a Champois regularily and fast because I couldn't get the head skimmed and how two gaskets didn't seem to last twice as long as one !! Never did any training for this !
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Phil,
Thanks I'll call him for a chat next week.
M.
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The Maserati doesn't look like a saloon car. The Biturbo and its derivatives did, but the 3200GT is a proper Grand Tourer and looks the business.
HJ
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Ok, having looked it up I'll give you that it doesn't look like a saloon car.
But it still looks a little "sensible" ?
If anybody is interested...
www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/lancia/58/gallery/...m
&
www.auho.com/98cars/Maserati3200GT.html
but, compared to this....
www.classicscars.com/ferrari/testarossa/testa.htm
I'm not so sure.
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Ok, having looked it up I'll give you that it doesn't look like a saloon car.
But it still looks a little "sensible" ?
If anybody is interested...
www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/lancia/58/gallery/...m
&
www.auho.com/98cars/Maserati3200GT.html
but, compared to this....
www.classicscars.com/ferrari/testarossa/testa.htm
I'm not so sure.
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Why not buy a fast but more reliable & practical car for everyday use & rent a Ferrari for the weekend, ... so this can save the hassle of maintenance, etc. I remebered there are such clubs in the UK - you pay the fee & you can drive a number of fast cars, including Ferrari, for certain days a year, etc. (I think D. Hill, the former F-1 driver, is with this club). If I were you, I would buy a Porsche.
Good luck.
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GY wrote:
>
> Why not buy .........
Because when I was younger I loved them and never dreamed I would have the opportunity to own one. And renting one just wouldn't be the same.
Just an ambition which I am fortunate enough to be able to consider.
However, the Porsche is an option, as I explained to David in an earlier reply.
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Whoooosh ;-)
Or you could try:
www.bogush.fsnet.co.uk/Ecology.htm#Liftsharing
Untill you made a decision.
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Check the FAQ answer on hiring something special on this site. There's more to it than The Backroom, you know.
HJ
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Maserati 3200GT?
Well, looks very nice and some faintly praising reports are probably a reflection of limited junketing for writers. But, it does look like a coupe version of the Daewoo Leganza!
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