I'm aware that the Partner Combi and the Berlingo Multispace are pretty well the same thing, however I was told today by a Peugeot salesman that not only are these two made on neighbouring production lines BUT so are the Renault Kangoo and the Fiat Doblo. He was adamant that they are all made by Peugeot and sold with different badges with just cosmetic changes. He said it's cheaper to let Peugeot to make them and sell them under their own respective names. He also said that they're not made in Spain, as I thought, but in East Germany (does that still exist?).
It all seems a bit unlikely to me but I put it to the panel and await their thoughts with bated breath.
KB.
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What has your salesman been smoking, exactly?
He's probably new on the job and just came back from the errand to get the striped paint and will shortly be looking for a sky hook and a long weight.
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According to my copy of TG mag, which lists Country Of Manufacture for all new cars on sale, the Peugeot, Citroen and Renault are all built in France, and the FIAT in Italy! So none of them in Eastern Europe, or indeed Spain.
IIRC the Fiat is a different vehicle entirely to the Partner/Berlingo, and also the Renault is unique too. The Peugeot and Citroen are very closely related, not certain about them being built on the same line or not though.
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Puntos and Seicento are made in Poland are they not. Whilst TG says that BMs are made in Germany, some 3 series are made in South Africa, It confuses me 'cos mine says its made in Germany
although I would find it less than bothering if it was made in SA.
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The Peugeot and Citroen are very closely related, not certain >> about them being built on the same line or not though.
Having driven both a Citroen Berlingo Van and a Peugeot Parter Van today, I could see nothing different apart from the badges on the front, side, rear, and steering wheel. They are totally identical, right down to the stereo, which would lead me to believe they are built on the same line.
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I don't know about the modern Fiats, but who ever made my Fiat Regata was obviously on the wacky bakkie.
It was a truly TERRIBLE car!
Hugo
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Peugeot own Citroen, so no suprises there! There's no link with Renault though as far as I know. However, new Corsa shares some features with Punto as GM have stake in Fiat. Should also see Nissans looking more like Renaults soon as well or vice versa! And how many Saab purists realise they're driving a Vauxhall these days? And I guess most Audi/VW owners are aware they're driving a Skoda by now! The list goes on......
Baz
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The answer to my question seems to be an emphatic NO. The salesman to whom I spoke today was obviously talking tosh.
A couple of pieces trawled up just now courtesy of Google as follows........
www.waitnews.com/peugeot_partner
There is big market in Europe for light vans. France is by far the biggest market, and the French trio are the most successful in the sector. Having said that, the Peugeot Partner Combi is built in Spain, at the Vigo plant, where around 55,000 were built in 2001.
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www.worldmarketsanalysis.com/wma/WMASampLightVeh.h...l
There will also be one European exception to the 'one platform per plant' rule, namely Vigo in Spain, which will make PSA's 'high body' vehicles, the Berlingo/Partner and Picasso.
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Peugeot Citroen : Manufacturing
PSA Peugeot Citroën has built up a global industrial infrastructure comprising 14 assembly plants, of which three are run in partnership with other manufacturers, and 18 component and casting plants.
Location Products Annual Production 1997 Annual Production 2001 Workforce 1997
Aulnay Saxo, 106 259.200 355.100 5.225
Mulhouse 206, 206CC, 307 340.000 455.300 10.487
Poissy 306 198.900 n.a. 8.619
Rennes Xsara, C5 235.200 315.600 8.871
Sochaux 307, 406, 605 222.800 383.100 18.405
Sevelnord* 50% Citroen 50% Fiat Peugeot 806 Expert, Citroen Evasion, Citroen Jumpy, Fiat Ulysse, Scudo, Lancia Zeta 123.900 144.600 3.600
French Plants (Source : PSA)
International Plants (Source : PSA)
Location Products Annual Production 1997 Annual Production 2001 Workforce 1997
Mangualde (Portugal) Citroen Berlingo, Peugeot Partner 28.700 50.100 652
Madrid (Espagne) Xsara n.a. 151.000 n.a.
Palomar (Argentine) 206, Citroen Berlingo, Peugeot Partner n.a. 45.500 n.a.
Ryton (U.K.) 206 85.300 190.200 3.604
Vigo (Spain) Xsara, C15, Citroen Berlingo, Peugeot Partner 270.900 488.100 6.633
Villaverde (Spain) 205, 306 138.100 4.402
Sevel (Italy) Peugeot Boxer, Citroen Relay, Fiat Ducato 145.900 189.200 4.140
Porto Real (Brazil) 206, Xsara Picasso n.a. 18.100 2000 planned
Sevel (Argentina) 306,405, 504, 504 pick-up, Partner & Berlingo 140.000 n.a. 2.448
Wuhan (China)
Seems conclusive enough to me - the Berlingo/Partner is built in Vigo in Spain and in Portugal and Argentina, by the looks of it, and the others have no connection at all.
KB.
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KB
Having looked into this very recently I can say that the Partner/Berlingo are the same. The trim levels differ (cassette player in the Berlingo, CD in the Partner, for example) and the added options are more expensive on the Citroen (the base vehicle is cheaper), but the vehicles themselves are identical.
However, the Fiat Doblo and the Renault Kangoo are quite different--note the visible sliding door runner on these two. They are less refined, noisier (much, much noisier), and more van-like--they even have van-style rear doors--though no doubt new models will be along soon putting this right. They are also narrower and apparently slightly longer (I haven't measured, they just look it). They are not made on the same production line, unless it's a very clever one.
The Pug/Cit is far and away the best of the lot; really a fantastic vehicle.
Chris
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>>Citroen Evasion
>>Citroen Jumpy
And I thought it was only the Japanese who had weird car names!
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The Evasion is the Synergie in the UK, and the Jumpy is the Dispatch (the medium sized one, the Peugeot Expert)
The big Citroën van, the Relay, is known as the Jumper in France and the rest of Europe.
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Ah, which would explain why a couple of them are used as cabs round here then. Taxi Evasion...
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Thanks for those replies.
I noted that the Pug is available in 'Escapade' form. 28mm higher off the ground + plastic headlamp protectors + a sump protector, foglamps, extra plastic protective cladding around the wheel arches. It looks like the Kangoo 4x4 Trekka, but doesn't have 4WD. I would imagine in HDi diesel form it would make for practical transport but not for off road use. With ABS and Air Con. it retails at around £12000....less whatever discount will be available ( I reckon if you could get it for £10000 it's good value).
KB.
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The Escapade will be fine for tracks and grassy fields--let's face it, that's what "off road" means to most people--certainly a good alternative to a small 4x4 for road use. But it felt a bit "tottery" on the corners compared with the basic model; like a BX on the second suspension height setting. I imagine it would be more tiring on long trips being more susceptible to cross-winds. I'd go (actually I did go) for the basic HDI model and add the options you want. Ground clearance isn't bad anyway.
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Just logged on and see that clarification is needed. OK, you know that the Berlingo and Peugeot are the same car made in Spain; the Renault is made in France and probably elsewhere too and is no relation; but the Fiat Doblo is built in Turkey, and nowhere else, even though it is sold worldwide. Oh, and the Doblo with the turbo diesel (HTD) engine is both quick - faster then the Berlingo etc.- but also very refined and a delight to drive with perfectly weighted steering having only 2.5 turns lock-to lock (like an Alfa) and a delightful gearchange. The ride is level and firmer than the French vehicles, giving a far sportier drive. The drivers\' seat is height adjustable and the total package results in one fine vanny-car-type thing. It looks wacky as hell, but at least it\'s different and all the little oddities are there for a sensible purpose. Actually, it\'s a better car than the Berlingo, but being less conventional will limit the appeal in Britain. Good, I like the rarity.
Enjoy your driving,
Zip
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Zip
You'll notice this thread originated in January 2003. I test drove a few of these things a year ago now when, at least according to the dealer, the Doblo JTD wasn't available. It was a choice between (if I recall) a very noisy and rather crude 1.9 atmo-diesel (much more crude than my then twelve year-old Citroen 1.9D) and a 1.2 petrol. (1.2 petrol? What were they thinking? It must have been hideous.) I agree the JTD is a good engine and no doubt the Doblo is more of an equal competitor now, but when I was looking it wasn't in the same league--not a nice place to be at all. The Renault has no doubt come on a bit since then too.
Have you just bought one?
Chris
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IIRC Peugeot and Renault had a brief courtship in the late seventies which might even have produced the odd child (ever notice how much the Renault 14 looked like a Pug104, particularly if you lifted the bonnet).Peugeot then ran off with Chrysler\'s European organisation as well as having a bit on the side with Citroen (or was that the other way round?). Some Douvrin plant engines shared round France eg V6 units which also found their way into Volvos.
Liaison with Fiat limited to the 806/Ulysse and their van derivatives.
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