The panic alarm is activated by pressing and holding the lights on button on the key fob.
If they say this is being activated I suspect a fault somewhere with the car receiving the panic alarm signal erroneously. The remote might be faulty.
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Rigby,
Do you live by a radio transmission masts of any sort ?
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PU could be on to something though...I have no idea what kind of property the car is at, a new wireless router or wireless doorbell installed by neighbours has been known to cause problems with car electrics.
Does the problem only occur at home or when out and about too ?
Edited by gmac on 10/01/2010 at 18:32
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gmac. I have six different electrical faults: courtesy light illuminates erratically. Passenger airbag warning light illuminates erratically. Amber & red warning lights illuminate erratically. GPS operates erratically. Remote door key opertates erratically. Alarm operates erratically. I have had problems with all of the above between 15th March 2008 and today when driving from my home in UK to Greece and various UK journeys. The only common factor is electrics and the intransigence of Jaguar HQ in Warwick. Their RTM inspected the car on 10th December and reported that there was nothing wrong with the car. Since then, the courtesy light has illuminated once briefly; the red warning light (but not the amber, for the first time) illuminated briefly; the remote door lock failed to operate three times; the alarm sounded four times in the space of three hours on 4th January.
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Avant, They have replaced all - ALL door sensors, boot sensor and bonnet sensor, but the alarm keeps going off. The alasrm is only one of the current SIX problems I am experiencing.
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Ok - cheers Rigby - I missed the bit about the vid.
Like most motor dealers, you will get the good with the bad.
my sister bought a sports jag about 18 months ago - the climate control stopped working. her other half took the car to the dealer - no worries they said we will repair under warranty. When they went to pick up the car, they were presented with a large invoice. To cut a long story short, jag claimed it was a speed hump damage and these cars/xj8. My sisters other half argued he should have been advised at the very least. He refused to pay and went home and got a call stating they will remove part. he contacted the franchise dealers CEO and the pettiness of their rep - the CEO cleared the invoice within ten mins.
it is luck of the draw who you speak to.
i'm sure you remain polite and calm as that is the only way forward
good luck!
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Leaving the car with them is rather different to swapping cars with the service manager or dealer principal so they have to use it to and from work and perhaps over a weekend.
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If the dealer refuses to accept your word, another possible approach before court would be to get an independent expert (eg. Chartered automotive engineer) to write a report or statement. If they don't accept that, at least the report will carry weight in court so will not be money wasted.
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Cheddar. Sorry, I did not make myself clear. Up until this latest incident with the alarm, when they didn't have a loan car available, they have always supplied a loan car. It got to the stage where I was joking with them that they got to drive my car more than I did! On the 23rd - 27th March visit I authorised them to use my car as much as possible - they did over 500 miles and still could not replicate the problems. Both the agents that I have used have been excellent - a credit to the name Jaguar. Sadly, the same cannot be said of the staff from CEO to office cleaner. I suggested to a previous correspondent that they should phone me on 01264-323565 and let me have their e-mail address to send a copy of my complaints log I have been maintaining - so far it is about 1 1/2 pages of A4 paper.
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Rigby, which orange & red lights ? I'm ex Jag mechanic & had several x types myself & over 30 years in the trade give me some clues.
Its possibly Alternator/ batt related. If the battery has an internal fault it could explain lights at random & alarm going off. I suspect it has a modu;le fault or instrument pack fault which is fairly common.
I loved my 2.2d but do find the dealers vary in level of service or attention as everythings about profit.
Perhaps you can get the mods to send me the video clip. Do you have any dash faults logged?
Press miles reset button & hold, turn ign on ( don't start) & hold untill test is diplayed, then kleep pressing button once at a time untill you get to "no dtc" or DTC is flashing. scroll through the codes & put them on the forum. Just turn ign off & restart all will be back to normal. There are approx 40 odd different scenarios to scroll through so don't panick at the goobly gook.
Inj Doc
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E-mail me the viseo clib Rigby, I'll sort it with ID
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injection doc. What a pity you are an ex Jag mechanic. The car is parked in the village at the moment since I can't get it up the hill to the house with the snow. As soon as I can get back to the car I will respond.
The amber and red lights are at 5 o'clock & 7 o'clock on the speedo. The manual says the amber light means the DPC is full and has lit several times when on a trip of +/- 100 miles. The red light means that there is a problem and the car should be taken straight into a Jaguar agent who then reports that there is nothing wrong. When they are lit, there is no change in the message centre to advise the nature of the problem, and I have scrolled through the usual mpg, distance run, distance to go etc.
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injection doc. I pressed miles reset button & held while I turned ign on without starting. I held reset button & it scrolled through to say it had reset trip A etc, but it just kept ro0lling thorugh the normal resetting messages - it never went further than that despite me holding in the reset button for about 10 minutes.
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Rigby I am staggered to read of the apparent incompetence and intransigence of Jaguar in dealing with your woes. What I can't quite follow is that you say the 2 agents are excellent and a credit to Jaguar but that the staff from CEO to office cleaner are not up to much plus neither of these agents had managed to even analyze the faults with your car, never mind repair them. Why do you hold these people in such high esteem?
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THEY TRIED! They treated me and my concerns with courtesy and understanding. They are Webbers of Basingstoke and HA Fox of Southampton. They went to lengths to trace the problems that I would not expect from lesser people. Sadly, I cannot say the same for Jaguar HQ in Warwick who have - in all but name - accused me of lying and falsifying evidence. I would recommend the car to anyone since I am positive that I have a Friday car and that for most other Jaguars the warranty is simply a nice little bit of reassurance - I now know that the Jaguar warranty is not worth the paper it is written on. See the Lemonlaw website in USA where the Jaguar warranty seems to have as little importance as it does in UK.
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I think I get it. The agents have been courteous and willing but can't fix it and HQ are the one who are being obstructive?
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Armitage Shanks. Affirmative. Electrical faults are notoriously difficult to trace, so despite all efforts the agents have not been able to replicate the faults in order to trace the cause. I suspect a large part of the problem is that the diagnostic machine works wonders in most instances, resulting in the operatives losing their basic skills and losing their ability to think laterally: one of the many problems with this brave new world we all live in. The point is, as the purchaser of the car the problems experienced by technicians are simply not my problem. I bought a car in the expectation that it would fulfill my requirements of carrying me from A:B quickly, comfortably and reliably and that means that my particular car is simply not fit for purpose. On that basis I believe that the Jaguar warranty should do what it says - repair or replace. The local agent could not repair and I could not expect them to replace so I went to the top - Jaguar Cars Ltd, Warwick and suggested that my car should be replaced. Unfortunately I encountered a bunch of 6" people in 12" jobs who could not get around the idea that because of a lot of silly little warning lights illuminating, they should replace the car. To an extent I can understand them, but having had a car catch fire before through an electrical fault, I am a little paranoid about repeating the experience. The fact that all my problems are electrical indicates to me that there is an electrical fault, so to me they are not simply "silly little warning lights" that I can ignore. That means that I either scrap my car and buy another, or I demand a replacement car and let the manufacturers do the scrapping.
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I could not expect them to replace so I went to the top - Jaguar Cars Ltd Warwick and suggested that my car should be replaced.
I'm sure your solicitor must have told you this but you're wasting your time with Jaguar. They have no liability towards you.
Did you buy the vehicle new, from a UK Jaguar dealer?
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Bill Payer. You sound pretty positive that I am wasting my time with Jaguar and that they have no liability towards me. Have you read their warranty? I might be a little old fashioned, but my understanding of a warranty has always been that it is a legally binding document. My solicitor seems pretty confident that it is a legally binding document, and I cannot imagine why all manufacturers - whether in the motor industry or washing machines - should waste their time printing something that has no value.
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You sound pretty positive that I am wasting my time with Jaguar
Rigby,
It's not the warranty that's the problem, Jaguar are well known for honouring them, take the Nikasil bore problems a few years back on V8 engines....they coughed up pronto on them and that cost them many thousands each time.
The problem is they cannot replicate the faults when they have your car...probably, as mentioned above, because they have fitters nowadays, not mechanics....and if the computer says no, it's no.
Get an Independent to look at it, as i've mentioned below, find the fault, then go back with some evidence or in depth knowledge for Jag to fix under the warranty
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My solicitor seems pretty confident that it is a legally binding document
I don't know how it can be as no contractural relationship exists between you and Jaguar Cars UK (unless you bought the car directly off them).
On other consumer goods, it's a common thing that a retailer will refer complaints to the manufacturer but standard legal advice is that they can't do that - the buck stops with the retailers.
From: www.consumerdirect.gov.uk/after_you_buy/know-your-...2
"Remember, if you are entitled to a refund, replacement, repair or compensation, it is the trader who must sort out your problem. The trader cannot tell you to go back to the manufacturer."
Having said that, there is a case on here in the Corsa camshaft failure thread where someone started proceedings against Vauxhall UK in the small claims court, but Vauxhall did settle before it got to court.
I ask again, where did you buy the car - was it new from a UK Jaguar dealer?
Edited by Bill Payer on 11/01/2010 at 22:50
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I don't know how it can be as no contractural relationship exists between you and Jaguar Cars UK (unless you bought the car directly off them). >>
Bill Payer :
A contract can exist between manufacturer and customer even if the goods are supplied by a middleman trader.
Consumer law gives statutory rights which cannot be taken away by the seller, but there is no law that says these rights cannot be added to by the manufacturer through additional guaranty or warranty or whatever if they so wish.
"If the manufacturer of the goods provides a free guarantee with the goods, this creates a contractual obligation by the guarantor. If the manufacturer fails to honour the guarantee, you could sue the manufacturer for the promises he makes. A guarantee is extra to your rights under the Sale of Goods Act. In some circumstances, you may have a claim under the guarantee, but find that a claim under the Sale of Goods Act would be difficult to prove, or vice versa. You may also in some circumstances have a claim against both, and therefore have a choice of who to claim against. If you are unsure seek advice from your local Trading Standards Service.
A trader or manufacturer cannot, however, take away any rights you would have under the Sale of Goods Act "
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Have you tried a good Jag independent? I find that they are used to dealing with older and higher mileage vehicles (and therefore the vehicles are more likely to have faults), so know a lot more than the main dealers.
I can recommend one near J26 M25...if not get a copy of Jaguar World Monthly, there's loads of adverts in there for Jag independents.
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Westpig. Thanks for your suggestion but I wouldn't dare take the car to any unauthorised repairer until the warranty has expired on 2nd July in case it invalidates the warranty.
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why not speak to westpigs recommended place and see if they have an insight
you could then if they can fix it bill your warranty people for the fix
better than having an unusable car because both sides are intransigent i feel?
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Wyn Thomas Jaguar, they're easily found on Google. ....01992 578555 if not.....damned good outfit. They will often give advice on the phone.
I'm happy for a Mod to give you my name if you wish to name drop on the phone...they've given me good service for years....and i've recommended them to many.
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but I wouldn't dare take the car to any unauthorised repairer until the warranty has expired on 2nd July in case it invalidates the warranty.
fair point, but you could still do that...then go back to Jag and say something like "Someone's suggested it could well be blah,blah, blah"....Jag would never know an Indie bunged it on a diagnostic machine etc....and you wouldn't be lying...just not being as open as you could be.....which in the circs would be acceptable in my book.
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"Jag would never know an Indie bunged it on a diagnostic machine etc." actually they would as it logs & dates everything. On IDS it even logs time & dates excess speed, & keeps it in the history!
I would probably suggest a data recorder plugged into the diagnostic socket ( its like a flight recorder) & when the lights come on the have the data analyed to see if there are any strange behaviour patterns or the battery voltage is suddenly fluctuating.
Its iether a module fault or poor earth somewhere or a voltage spike that isn't enough to flag a fault as the any eratic behaviour is still within parameters.
Is any other electronic equipment being used in the car ? Ie phone etc. is there any interference?
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Rigby
The DPC lights could be triggered by pressure in the exhaust, but may be not long enough to record an event.The air bag light could be a faulty seat sensor, were not uncommon. If you have a very light passenger in them the light will stay on if its not really safe for the passenger to sit in the seat. ie small child. The alarm could be battery voltage fluctuation. The remote fobs failing can be caused by interference from buildings etc. i had one parking space at work that if i parked in the boot blip would not work however hard you tried.
Whats your style of driving ? long runs or lots of short? & are you fairly light on the throttle & what fuel do you normally buy. ( just want to get an idea of what may be happening to the DPF)
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The airbag light could be the clockspring in the steering wheel, does it happen when manouvering?
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If you have a very light passenger in them the light will stay on if its not really safe >>for the passenger to sit in the seat. ie small child.
Could a brief case do that?....or similar
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Could a brief case do that?....or similar
>>
Yes, a brief case on the passenger seat triggers the airback light though only if the seatbelt is fastened, I know because I tried using the belt to stop the case from sliding off.
In truth nothing on the seat triggers the light if the belt is fastened.
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I've never understood why there are so many problems with the X-type (which there are unfortunately) it's based on a vary reliable car in the Mondeo - what did they do to it!? I've often fancied the idea of a 3 litre manual, like having a comfy Impreza! Sadly the continuous stories of unreliability have put me off.
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Suggest to dealer plugging a Crecorder into the diag socket to log data, if they cant or wont then consider buying one yourself (they are only about £50 and you can flog it on ebay when youve finished with it).
Bear in mind instrument packs can be a bit dodgy on these jags, so the dealer should consider that too.
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THANK YOU ALL VERY MUCH FOR ALL YOUR EFFORTS - FANTASTIC!
I am hopeful that things might at last been happening - after just one year of continual pestering and a file as thick as a bible!
I phoned the agent that has been servicing the car and trying to trace faults, and I suspect he may have lost patience and chased Warwick HQ. My solicitor also phoned them. Trading Standards in Winchester have done stirling work. Motor Industry Codes of Practice has demanded an explanation. Last, but certainly not least, I suspect that one or two of you have also had something to do with it - Thank you one and all.
I hope I am not being over-optimistic, but there is a sudden very strong silence from Jaguar and I suspect that a parrot has been knocked off its perch and is now scurrying around covering his/her backside!
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I am an electrician(not auto electrician unfortunately) and after reading through all the posts i would like to suggest something.If your having numerous electrical faults in all aspects of the car then surely the cause points to either the battery going faulty or the alternator.
I would have thought that they would have replaced both of these to eliminate them.
We have a Vivaro van and had trouble with the engine running very rough and all sorts of lights coming on.When we took it to the garage it turned out to be a multiplug that had worked loose and the mechanic said that it was showing half a dozen faults from all over the van.Once the plug and socket where sorted the van ran fine again.Getting back to your Jag maybe a multiplug(that feeds lots of different electrical items)could be faulty hence why your getting numerous faults from all over the place.
I would still place money on the battery,alternator being faulty though.
Regards.
Videodoctor.
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