Small feet? long arms - very long left arm? no problem! Ssshhh - no names please..
But just returned from a showroom.
Three new small cars in the marque.
1) The newest model.
Left (size 11 broad fitting) shoe, just about clears clutch pedal. Push seat back - then lower seat to get required leg room. It`s then like sitting in the bottom of a bucket trying to look out over the rim - gear lever - very forward and over to the left, at extreme reach of a long left arm. Crank seat up. Knees bent double.
2) The other small model.
Left foot jams at side of pedal - you would need a slim fitting size two to drive it comfortably. Clutch pedal also raised well above other two pedals. Why?
3) The next car size up.
Sitting in the bottom of the bucket again to get leg room.
If you put a chimpanzee in there would be no problem with any of them. A message from the maker?
Best not to name the marque of course
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I'm glad it's not just me that has these problems!
I keep feeling the pressure to downsize and so sometimes visit showrooms to see what wee cars they've got, and yet it takes all of 2 seconds tops of sitting in the drivers seat, prodding the brake and clutch at the same time with just my left foot to see it ain't gonna work for me!
I'm only a size 9 too...
And why do they put the accelerator so much lower than the other pedals these days, have most folk got a longer right leg nowadays?
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So that you get it wrong going for the brakes and keep the body shop in business...
OK so tongue in cheek but it does annoy me. I went to great trouble making it as quick as possible to go between pedals on the Morgan I adapted to competition.
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I agree, - I drove a Pug 106 once, and everytime i pressed the brake pedal I would hit the throttle as well
it was just far to small for me, with my knees up around my ears and one foot operating all 3 peddles at once, and this was with the seat as far as back as it would go.
the only car i can comfortably downsize to is something Astra/Focus size (although I still find the Astra (G and F) a little too cramped for my taste. but at least I can operate the pedals, and fit my legs under the steering wheel
Edited by redviper on 08/10/2009 at 18:03
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In a cramped footwell, and if a car is to be driven sportily, you want the throttle pedal to be level with the brake pedal when the brakes are being applied.
In the former case to avoid accidentally hitting the throttle and in the latter to aid "heel and toeing"
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Back in the fifties and sixties, car testers used to complain that Italian cars were designed to fit chimpanzees, short-legged and long-armed as Italians were thought to be. I have to say it never bothered me, but testers always went on about it.
Has the chimp build spread further east oilrag? I think we should be told.
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I can feel a tree full of monkeys hanging overhead, Lud - holding badge polishing cloths. Even a hint is not possible..
(I`m plugging the essay comp again at this point. ONLY 26 HRS LEFT !!)
Edited by oilrag on 08/10/2009 at 18:54
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Have some sympathy for a moment for the poor feller that has to shoe horn himself into these things whilst mincing about around truck structural pillars and safety rails etc restricting door opening on the transporter...thats me by the way.
I think the basic problem is the very shallow angle of the A pillar on modern stuff and getting worse, you have to be semi reclining to get away from it, and then as Oily says you're just about peering over the ever higher doors and partly through the wheel.
Cars like Berlingo and C3 Picasso are so nice in this respect.
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Back in the fifties and sixties car testers used to complain that Italian cars were designed to fit chimpanzees short-legged and long-armed as Italians were thought to be.
Back in the nineties my father had an Alfa - 156 I think it was - Impossible to find a comfortable driving position. If I pushed the seat back so that the legs felt right I could not reach the steering wheel. Adjust it forward for proper control of the steering wheel and the pedals were so close that my knees were touching my chin. Horrible car.
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Indeed, the only Itialan car I ever had was a GTV, the one with the rear transaxle. Designed for short legs, long arms. Fantasic to drive when it was on form but a lot of time in the workshop to keep it on form.
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I agree - I drove a Pug 106 once and everytime i pressed the brake pedal I would hit the throttle as well
Yes, I know what you mean about the Pug 106 - I had the same problem. But it was a small car and so is perhaps understandable.
What amazed me when I tried a manual Audi A5 convertible a couple of months ago was how hopeless the pedals on that were. A complete non-starter (or rather back-breaker) for me.
And yet all we read about in the motoring press is how wonderful Audis are ... load of rubbish!
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I'm 6ft tall, size 11 shoe and have driven Pandas for the past 4 years.
I find this tiny car the most comfortable I've had for a long time.
As much fun and as amenable as a Mini 850cc.
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Both my sons drive my Mark 1 Yaris with no difficulty. One is 6ft 3 inches, the other 6 ft 2 inches.
And they can fit as passengers as well..100 mile trips with 4 up are quite comfortable. It is the T Spirit with driver seat height rake etc adjustment.
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Our new colt.............still waiting, has acres of space.
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I think I have the opposite problem to most here. I'm 5'7" with average-length arms but shorter-than-average legs. I'm comfortable in most cars but the BMW 3-series defeats me: in order to depress the pedals I need to sit too close to the wheel. Maybe I'm the Standard Italian Ape, as mentioned above.
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Is it significant here that Toyota and Mitsubishi are Japanese makers and so design, even if not in Japan, at least with an eye to RHD markets? The French makers, on the other hand, are more concerned with their LHD home markets, where the wheelarch creates a space for the clutch pedal.
My father, who had size 12 feet like me, reckoned he was comfortable in a LHD 106, whereas I abandoned my one attempt at a RHD one because I couldn't work the pedals. My only experience of a LHD manual was an Ibiza many years ago, and that seemed to have plenty of foot room.
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No problem in a Volvo 240, designed for long-legged Swedes with short arms.
Seat right back, wheel at a comfortable distance for supporting elbows, easy view over the wheel and the front edge of the long bonnet, or over the back seats to the far corners.
Tilt or adjust the seat height so that the front edge doesn't nip the legs and cause DVT.
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Come on now, OR, name and shame... you know you want to!
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I'm 5'7" with average-length arms but shorter-than-average legs. I'm comfortable in most cars but the BMW 3-series defeats me: in order to depress the pedals I need to sit too close to the wheel.
Avant - this is weird. I am exactly the same build as you, and yet I don't have any problem at all finding a comfortable driving position with the 3-series! I always have the seat quite high - I wonder if that is the difference?
The cars that I have problems with are Audis - the pedals are offset too far to the right in RHD cars. In all other respects, though, I am a big fan of Audis.
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Interestingly, these are the average male heights across major car producer populations (most pessimistic survey results given here, because I'm mean like that):
France: 5'9"
Germany: 5'10"
Italy: 5'8"
UK: 5'10"
Sweden: 5'10"
Japan: 5'7"
USA: 5'10"
It really does appear possible that cars from certain countries may be more suited to taller or shorter people.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_height
On shoe size, the UK is now a size 9 average, and growing. I couldn't find any data for EU countries on shoe size, sadly.
tinyurl.com/yjjxetu
If you argue that shoe size is directly related to height (very contentious) then it's easy to see why French and Italian cars might have the pedals spaced too close, especially if they're small cars intended for women.
However, some people argue foot size is directly related to length of forearm, in which case the "short legs, long arms" syndrome seems odd in French cars (picking on them because of my experience with many different Peugeots here), where the pedal box is small, thus implying small feet...
I had nightmares with the old 206 with the pedal spacing and found it was no better in the 107, 207 or 308. Only the 407 had enough space between the pedals for me, and that felt like my legs were too long or arms too short!
Perhaps it's as simple as poor car design and nothing to do with local population body shapes.
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However some people argue foot size is directly related to length of forearm >>
There is another theory but it is not motoring-related.
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I have no idea what you mean...I couldn't find any data on that either... ;)
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20 odd years ago my mate used to drive a fiat 500 and I had the original Panda. He was well over 6ft (drum major) at a well known military camp. Now he could find a good driving position in his 500 but the larger Panda didn't suit at all.
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