And do you use it in day-to-day driving?
A vehicle handbook I read described the red line as 'not suitable for extended periods of operation'.
I'm inclined to put the car through the gears now and again, and the CC3 has already seen the start of the red line, if only for a second.
There's little other point in redlining most of the cars I've driven, as the engine is past both peak power and torque by then.
I suppose this may not apply to high-revving engines/Japanese multi-cylinder motorcycles.
And just to complicate matters, don't some cars have an orange zone on the rev counter as well?
Edited by Dynamic Dave on 23/03/2009 at 10:16
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My mate says the redline is music to his ears - he's a mechanic and has tales to tell of people who think it's a great idea to redline a car first thing in the morning................
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Why would you want your engine to run at 8,000 rpm for an extended period. Change up, save wear to the engine, save petrol
I don't think I've ever driven a car that has felt as though it's still pulling at that sort of level before my new Legacy.
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I run to the redline (or just past it and change up just before the limiter) regularly. Its a Honda VTEC with an 8000RPM redline and the rev limit upped to 8500 from 8300. Whilst its true that the power has started to tail off by the up shift, it means that we're into the power band after the up shift. If I change up earlier then its not quite in the power band. Its got just over 100K miles on it and I don't seem to have any wear problems. In fact I know of other Honda B16s driven equally as hard with over 200K miles on them and still in perfect health.
Edited by 832ark on 23/03/2009 at 10:15
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Passat TDi is still accelerating like the proverbial right up until the limiter. Haven't taken it there for nearly a month now, always had passengers or speed limits to get in the way. :)
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The red line is the guidance point for an Italian tune-up.
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Honda Vtec 2.2 rev limiter cuts in at about 8300 (I've only hit it once...) and the engine felt as though it would just go on up, pulling like a train.
Last year I saw one of the 50 original Bentley 4.5 litre 'Blower' supercharged cars, in delightful condition, as if it was used every day and had been for the last 80 years. It even had the remains of a 'just married' sign on the back!
At the 5000 mark on the ginormous rev counter was a little strip of Dymo tape with the word 'BANG'.
Edited by mike hannon on 23/03/2009 at 10:21
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BANG
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Yeah - BANG.
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I echo the posters who simply replied 'BANG!'
Your engine might not go 'bang' if you exceed the rev limit, but if it does, you can only blame yourself!!
One lorry I used to drive had a green sector on the rev counter, in addition to a red line. The green sector is where you were encouraged to keep the needle to make the most efficient use of the engine.
Edited by Sofa Spud on 23/03/2009 at 10:38
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The Volvo has a red line from 6000 RPM which becomes more pronounced at 7000 RPM. The engine revs to about 6500 RPM indicated, which it will do, but the final 1000 RPM is a bit of a struggle.
The Golf redlines at 4500 RPM. I can't envisage ever getting near it. Daily driving involves upchanges at 2500 RPM, press on driving at 3000 RPM.
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Honda 4 cylinder bike engines would happily rev through the red lines - there was an advisory in the handbooks (along the lines of don't do it to often - yeah right), but then again bike engines are generally better engineered than car engines.
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Full throttle upchanges.
Isn't that what rev limiters are for?
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Broken Corsa camshafts, failed cambelts, blown turbos, generally trashed engines, and stressed out drivers.
Edited by Old Navy on 23/03/2009 at 10:56
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Ah yes, I almost forgot about my old ZZR600 (in line four). I've had it a needle's width or two past it's 14k redline before with no apparent ill effects. No VVT, no trick ignition mapping or inlet tract adjustment, and slurping its fuel through good old fashioned carburettors. Sounds absolutely glorious doing it, too.
The current generation Yamaha R6 (also 600cc inline four) revs to about 17,500 RPM.
I love bike engines.
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The upper graduation mark on my car's rev counter is at 7000 rpm, but there's no red line. The Owner's Guide specifies a maximum continuous engine speed of 5950 RPM and a maximum intermittent engine speed of 6175 RPM. With the engine having a maximum torque of 178 Nm at 4500 RPM, I don't find it necessary to get anywhere the stated maximum speeds. In fact in normal driving I rarely exceed 3000 RPM, which equates to 70 mph in top gear. I like my driving to be smooth and quiet.
Edited by L'escargot on 23/03/2009 at 10:51
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It usually means the maximum permitted safe engine speed for short durations.
Most modern cars have a rev limiter just above the start of the redline which stops the engine revving higher. On early injected cars this could be quite violent, I remember a Cavalier SRi that wouldn't kick back in until revs had dropped below 1,500rpm ... which was interesting if you needed full acceleration and wasn't keeping an eye on the tacho.
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My old 87 E 2.0i Cavalier used to rapidly oscillate +/- 300 revs below and back up to the 6500 cut-out level. Usually involved loads of tyre smoke and no forward motion. I've grown up since.
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Do I use a rev counter?
Yes, and I have to being deaf as I can't hear the engine running. Landrover can be pulling in 3rd, 4th, 5th and 6th just, so if you've forgotton what gear you were in, rather useful. No red line marked but like all dlesels max revs are limited.
I've added one to Morgan 3 wheeler, largely because the differebce between a fast idle, and a reasonable idle speed can't be felt and I don't want to do maths in my head and time the exhaust valve on number one cylinder (you can see it from the drivers set. No idea what the limit is, but according to some specs I have for twins fitted to 3 three wheelers, peak power is at 4200, so I fitted a 5000 instrument to get the maximum useful range. Engine has perhaps seen 4000 breifly, but seems a happy bunny at 2500, which is about 45. As the claimend to speed was 80, and the engine is thought to be doing rather many revs, I think my choice of instrument is reasonable.
The Morgan 4/4 had a much breathed upon crossflow and a rev counter as standard. 6000 was the standard Ford limit and I believe what I have is "safe" to 7500. I however set the rev limiter to 6800 in the interests of making it last. Power is falling off any way. Don't hit the limiter normally even in competition as changing up a gear is correct at 6000. But, occasionally it gets held hard against the limiter for a couple of seconds as slower times result from changing gear twice (up and back down). Possible doing this results in flames out the exhaust so not a done thing on the highway anyway!
Added - rev counter needed at starts. Dump clutch at about 4100, and revs mus not fall below 4000. Cruel but works.
Edited by SlidingPillar on 23/03/2009 at 14:17
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My rev counter does not have a red line - so i dont use it
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>The Owner's Guide specifies a maximum continuous engine speed of 5950 RPM and a maximum intermittent engine speed of 6175 RPM.<
I guess Fords must have very well calibrated rev counters or a lot of cross-eyed drivers...
I rarely pass 4,000 rpm but I admire people who still put faith in the engineering standards of today's auto manufacturers and go for it. I hope we don't one day have drivers who know nothing but oil-burners and have no experience of proper extended power bands. ;-)
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My Ford 16v's rev counter is redlined at 6,500 rpm, but there's nothing to be gained by using that engine speed. It's a completely different kind of tune from the Ford 1600 twin cam engine with Webers that powered Lotus Cortinas and the like. Indeed it has quite good urban mimsing low-down torque and will pull top gear happily on the flat from 1300-1500 rpm, using of course a very light foot.
I doubt if it has reached 5,500 more than a few times in my hands. 4,000 - a whisker over 90mph in top - is more than enough for normal use and I seldom use more than 3,500.
By the way, these modern things are tachometers. Rev counters were those wonderful Jaeger or Smith's jerky things.
Edited by Lud on 23/03/2009 at 16:01
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>>those wonderful Jaeger or Smith's jerky things.
IIRC they had something like 'chronometric' printed on the face.
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'chronometric' printed on the face.
Some of my old motorbikes have Chronometric speedometers. One has the rev counter and speedo dials going in opposite directions - at about 70 MPH the speedo. needle points straight up, the rev. counter needle straight down. AFAIK rev. counters have always properly been called tachometers (see also odometer, altimeter, etc.).
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My old 87 E 2.0i Cavalier used to rapidly oscillate +/- 300 revs below and back up to the 6500 cut-out level. Usually involved loads of tyre smoke and no forward motion. I've grown up since.
An 80's Vauxhall party piece. I could actually get my old mk2 SRi up into 2nd and keep the wheels spinning. Handbrake on, going nowhere. Yes, I know...
Cheers
DP
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The red line means "Here be Dragons" proceed at your own risk!
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Old Civic 1.8 VTi at 106k miles was still regularly reaching the red line at 8300rpm with zero drama. Had been doing the same since I got it at 35k miles. Used a little oil, but blew no smoke (common in high-tuned VTecs). I read in a VTi forum someone who did just over 100 miles at 135mph on an autobahn (7.5-8k rpm). Car never missed a beat, no problems since, but it used half a litre of engine oil in those 100miles!
As long as there is plenty of quality oil, the engine is fully warmed, and the cooling system is in good order up there is no problem red lining a car that doesn't have mechanical deficiencies such as worn bearings/chain/belt.
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