Don't buy a Ford with a DPF.
I've suffered 3 years of DPF problems, Ford Customer Service has been completely ineffective.
I'll never buy a Ford car again because of the lack of Customer Service.
But I do think the Focus is a great car, so if you must buy one, absolutely make sure it doen't have a DPF. If you buy one and get problems, you won't get any assistance from the dealer, the Customer Relationship Centre, or from Head Office.
If anyone is interested, I'm happy to provide further details of the specifc problems I've experienced, just post a request for further info.
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I'd be interested in comparing Ford DPF problems to Mazda DPF problems. But we would need to have it in a DPF thread in technical.
I would say for those reading this (it was an older thread) don't go down the DPF route if you can. But with Euro V regulations I would say all diesels will use DPF. My previous car, a Mondeo TDCi was EuroIV compliant without a DPF.
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I'm now at 9500 miles in my Mondeo IV 2.0 with DPF and no problems to report.
As posted elsewhere, I had an "oil service" light come on at 3500 miles, and the dealer (on instructions from Ford) changed oil & filter and reset a sensor's parameters in the ECU. The service manager explained they'd had a number of these cases and it was due to an oversensitive oil quality sensor. Not seen the light since.
The Mondeo DPF set-up seems different to Mazda's or VAG's, in that there is no DPF warning light sequence. You don't get an indicator to say the DPF needs a "regeneration run". Also there's nothing in the manual about oil levels rising, nor is there any special level marking on the dipstick.
My own observations indicate that, as well as ordinary regeneration in the right running conditions, the ECU forces a regeneration about every 500 miles, whether it's actually needed or not ... perhaps as a failsafe against DPF blocking.
I think this because a couple of times now, I've done long m/way runs where I'm at constant 2,500rpm for over an hour at a time -- which should leave the DPF as clean as a whistle.
Yet a day later, a renegeration will start on my 4-mile commute home -- and this seems to happen when the odo reads X,000 or X,500. These regens only take a couple of minutes, but have the sure signs of a) cooling fan being on and b) an exhaust tailpipe that is way too hot to touch.
I've not seen any specific DPF-related problems on the Mondeo forums as yet. But it is still fairly early days.
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"As posted elsewhere, I had an "oil service" light come on at 3500 miles"
My Mazda6 is about 3500 miles after it's first service which was at 12,000 miles. Oil level is about 1 inch above the full mark. The fact yours needed an oil change/service suggests to me it might be similar to the Mazda system.
You have to admit 3500 miles is quite soon to need an oil and filter change. Mine is getting changed next week as a precaution. The X mark on the dipstick is still a fair way above the oil level but I didn't want to take a risk. And when I explained to the lease company they suddenly agreed.
But I know mine is down to lots of local trips... first 12,000 miles were fine.
Edited by rtj70 on 18/12/2008 at 21:53
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Possibly, however during the first 5K miles I was fastidious about checking oil levels, so I could "index" the car's oil usage.
The oil level hadn't increased, it was more or less exactly where it always was.
A number of other Mondeo IV owners -- both 1.8 (non DPF) and 2.0 TDCI had early "oil service" lights, in some of these cases the owners reported that dealers just reset the light and did NOT do an oil change. Some owners reset it themselves using a little trick.
Oddly, on the S-Max forums there has been a couple of reports of failure of the VNT mechanisms on both 1.8 and 2.0 TDCIs, but I've not seen reports of DPF failures. Yet :)
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Your Mondeo IV it's brand new? Because starting with 2008 Mondeo 2.0 TDCI has a CDPF which it's maintenace free.
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A DPF is maintenance free but they do need to regenerate.
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>>A DPF is maintenance free but they do need to regenerate>>
But what about the ecolys fuild to top up at c£25 a litre? And the cost of hosing out the filter at 50k miles (for Citroens etc)?
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This is talking about DPF filters and not the FAP filters used by PSA which need the eolys fluid. DPF regenerate using a catalyst in the DPF itself - it's how they are made. Do not confuse a FAP filter and a DPF.
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DPF cars only acquire problems if they are driven short distances or town miles; becoming overwhelmed by the accumulation of soot.
This also occurs when regular diesel drivers treat like non-DPF, SDI, or even pre VNT diesel engines. By lugging them in low rev's which wouldn't harm an old diesel, you would just see plumes of black smoke exit the exhaust when the driver puts their foot down, usually hard.
Now EU emissions regulations states that particle emissions and Nox gases are to be below a certain level by something like 2010/12. I forget which.
So as of next year, all new diesels will have DPF which means a change of typical diesel driving style to ensure DPF do not become overwhelmed. Along with new common rail fuel injection and DNPR systems to rid that awful diesel NOX gas smell you won't be able to drive new diesels on extremely low revs without problems with carbon build up causing injector problems, fuel pump problems, spray pattern problems and even turbo problems.
Unless people adapt their typically diesel driving style to start cruising on the start of the max torque band, they also need to use 60% + throttle openings and go over 3.5k RPM more often, if not, they will have problems at between 40k and 60k miles.
Obviously m-way driving is excluded as at 70mph your on max torque so cylinder pressure is at its highest, along with air / fuel mix so the exhaust gas is hot enough to burn off all the crud.
2nd hand diesels beware, especially if its a low mileage, come 2014.
Edited by OldSkoOL on 03/08/2009 at 11:37
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What i do worry about is a lot of the common manufacturers are only just introducing common rail, DPF engined cars. I don't know any with DNPR apart from Toyota and maybe Honda. There has been little real world testing of these new technologies that are to become requirements. Toyota have had their DPR/DNPR common rail diesel engine in the market for 5 years now. It did have problems but it has been constantly refined and is now running very nicely.
Goodness knows how the other manufacturers / reliability ratings will get on when these all go mass market.
Edited by Webmaster on 04/08/2009 at 02:02
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Information regarding a CDPF :
CDPF - Catalysed Diesel Particulate Filter
The combination of a Silicium Carbide particulate filter with a duel function catalyst containing platinum and base metal. The catalyst lowers the soot combustion temperature, allowing the filter to self-regenerate during periods of high exhaust gas temperature.
Reduction of particulate matter (PM) and soluble organic fraction up to 98% .
Reduction of CO, HC and NO2 up to 90% .
Regenerates at normal diesel operating temperatures.
Does not require ultra low sulfur diesel or any additive.
In general the passive CDPF operating conditions requires an engine exhaust temperature above 250˚C for at least 30% of the operation.
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In general the passive CDPF operating conditions requires an engine exhaust temperature above 250 o C for at least 30% of the operation.
And if it doesn't do this before it is nearly full (i.e. temperature not reached) it will try an active regeneration by injecting diesel into the exhaust to burn and increase temperature. Some of this on some cars can end up in the sump.
If active regeneration does not happen then the car goes into limp mode and the car can only be regenerated at the dealers. And if left without doing this will eventually need a new DPF.
Edited by rtj70 on 04/08/2009 at 00:05
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Hi would like to hear some more info on this as am having a nightmare with a DPF myself..
I've had a Ford Focus 1.6 tcdi 06 plate for just over a year. I bought the car from a well know national car supermarket. In January the engine management light came on and it turned out that the DPF needed repenishing. As this was not covered in the entended warrenty I paid for, I had to bring it down to Ford and paid £100 for it.
Now the light has come back on and having taken it back to Ford they have said the DPF needs relacing completely and have quoted £850!!!! They have advised me to take it back to where I bought it because they believe that X did not replenish the DPF at the 3 year service as recommended by Ford (the company did the 3 years service just before I bought it). I have taken it down to them and put it across as strongly as possible. I am just note sure what I stand legally, is this just a recommendation by Ford??
Any help / comments would be appreciated. cheers
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I do not have a great deal of help to offer. I had the engine warning light come on so took my 1.6 Focus TDCI in. Additives were refreshed (seems a common occurence after 75,000) Since we have had it back the electrics have gone crazy.
The car keeps cutting out and there is no obvious trigger. In a brief and free discussion with a Ford dealer he thought the garage had done something wrong as a faulty EDF will cut engine. However the issue seems to be related to the immobiliser? The issue is intermittent and I have taken it back to the garge twice and they cannot find anyhting and have told me to take it to a Ford dealers - this will cost £100 just for a diagnosis!
Flushing ECU now - but that is just in the hope of the car getting to the Ford garage as it has started cutting out a great deal. After a cut out the engine will start but will not rev not matter how much pumping you do - it will jsut idle. The engine light is now back on.
I will take it to the ford garage but have been told that the it is down to the original garage to prove that they did not introduce the issue. Which is a little bit my word against theirs. But that is where I have been told I stand.
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Alright DPF Hell, I posted message below on another site, but no luck with replies.
Does the story sound familiar and can you add anything from your experiences.
My position at the mo, is I have taken car back from ford garage to get a second opinion as i don't believe a word they are telling me. What they have said is that, yes car is drivable but engine malfunction light will come on again when we next fill tank with diesal.
Hi,
Can anyone tell me if this senario has some substance.
I have a 2008 focus 1.6tdi with the dpf for low emmissions. Back in March this year I took it for 37500 major service ( actual miles was around 36500 ) to local garage who are in Ford Blue Oval Club and always use Genuine Ford parts - No problems with these guys, been sound for a number of years. They advised that car need the fuel addittive topping up, price quoted seemed expensive and they did say that we would get cheaper from a main dealer as third partys had to buy the full kit which was more than was required. Based on that we got a price over phone from nearest Ford dealer at £125.00, so we eventually booked it in about 3 weeks later. Sods law on the weekend before we took it in for this work done the Engine malfunction light came on, so when we took it in to dealer on the Monday we had to pay for a Diagnotics as well which pushed the cost upto £185.00 + vat. The mileage when the addittive was put in was 39600. Job was done, malfunction light gone out. Just this week, and 2000 miles later the Engine Malfunction Light has appeared again. Took it into same dealer and after 2 days and apparently 5 fault codes they have said it's 50/50 one of two things.
1. Needs a new fuel addittive tank + addittive at cost of £500 + vat, or
2. New Module, lot more expensive.
They have said we are almost sure it's the New Addittive tank option. They have said that the reason would be that because we did'nt have the top up done at the major service the addittive tank had run so low that it has got clogged up. They have also said that as of now there is fluid in there and the motor is spinning but there is no fluid being injected out.
If both those are correct, I cannot see why the car has been running fine for the past two months (2000 miles), surely they would have checked if it was working correct after they topped it up at 39600, but another question is if it was not checked at that time, how long would the car run afterwards before the engine malfunction light came on again.
Hope someone can help with this so I can take it forward.
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Change garages because they are taking the p*** or have no idea about the DPFsystem.
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