Do car sellers who misdescribe cars have to face any legal recourse or recourse from a purchaser? I bought a car privately last year. It was described as a decent car. It has turned out to be anything but. Most of the lights failed, the brakes were iffy, the steering had broken parts. I have kept on with it always thinking the next lot of repairs will turn it into being a reasonable car. The main problems left are persistent poor running and it losing oil. I also suspect the provenance of some parts that were replaced weren't as they were described either. Unfortunately I know the seller reasonably well and have to work with them via a owners club.
They also valued the car at way over market value recently and said I would likely to be able to get £9k for a part exchange. The most I have been offered so far was £6k. I can't afford to sell the car on at such a massive loss or absorb the full cost of repairs. I don't feel happy about selling the car on its current condition either as basically it is an absolute dog. My work situation has also deteriorated so I am about to have my income reduced drastically which doesn't help. I can't mention the make or model as it would identify me too much and things are a little delicate :-) I have asked the person I bought it from to buy it back at their valuation ( I am assuming they'll negotiate down). I also asked them to contact the garage that provided the duff part as they bought it. They haven't replied to either request.
Any ideas on what is the best way to proceed which reduces my potential losses the most?
teabelly
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If you can prove that:
>>It was described as a decent car.
and you can prove that the following items were not 'decent' at the time of purchase:
>>Most of the lights failed, the brakes were iffy, the steering had broken parts. I
then you might perhaps have a case.
But what is decent? If you have written evidence that it was sold claiming that e.g. the steering had been fully renewed then you might have some hope. Otherwise, none.
As for a dispute as to valuation, well that's your problem I'm afraid. Did you get an AA inspection?
Sorry to be so negative, but I'm sure you were expecting this.
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If you bought from a private seller then you have virtually no chance, unless you can prove that the seller set out to defraud you, which is a criminal offence. Even so, the chance of getting any money back, which you would have to do via the civil courts, is non-existent.
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I took it to a specialist not long after I bought it and they said it was a bit of a shed. They said I should take up the matter with the seller but the seller's reputation within the club put me off from making waves to be honest. It was due an MOT shortly after and it failed on the handbrake and a couple of other things such as anti roll bar bushes and something in the steering. The cooling fan didn't work - they said it did. 2 warning lights came on the way home. Brakes and coolant. It was leaking coolant. It was leaking oil. They claimed no knowledge of either.
I trusted the person selling it so I was less picky than I should have been. I do have it in writing that they described it as a decent car. I should have kept a copy of the ad as that was glowing. I kept the car and persisted with it as it is a rare model and there aren't many with this particular specificiation. I know now with hindsight I should have asked for a full refund straight away.
teabelly
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Perhaps, as a general strategy, your 'weakness' is also your strength. If the seller has any position or reputation to protect at the owners club (and it sounds as if he/she has) - might not a discrete advertisement of your woes soften the sellers stance on some sort of reparation?
If you've got a website based forum or similar, constant 'questions' asking for advice on the various probelms from your club members , with hints at the seller , might be enough to generate some compromise without overt naming-and-shaming?
On the legal side - from my layman's knowledge, private sales require a categoric mis-representation to invoke contract or sale of goods legislation, i.e. 'the car has a sunroof' when it doesn't etc. - general descriptions 'it's a good car' are much harder to prove mis-representation for.
I'm sure a proper legal eagle here could help more on the niceties of that.
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I think the key phrase in the OP is '...last year..' ie He's had over 8 months in which to reject the car and as I'm sure most know, the longer you leave it the harder it gets. Sorry for being negative.
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that's a new one on me. allowing the seller to value the car and then to agree with the price. in hindsight an aa inspection would have been useful.
i dont think you have any recourse at all except as said before and to assert a little pressure at the owners club etc..
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It was a club valuation so I assumed it would be reasonably legit.
teabelly
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It was a club valuation so I assumed it would be reasonably legit.
Is the person whom you bought it from running this club? And so he does valuations, and he makes money from the club? And so it's rather more of a business?
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Club is proper non profit, msa approved. Valuation was free. I'd imagine 10% over value as being par for the course but 50% is kind of taking the biscuit. Parker's puts retail at £6k with trade in at just over £4k. Don't think that is right either. Mind you I have only had my car to compare condition wise so it is difficult to say whether others are just the same.
teabelly
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> They also valued the car at way over market value recently and said I would likely to be able to get £9k for a part exchange. The most I have been offered so far was £6k. I can't afford to sell the car on at such a massive loss or absorb the full cost of repairs. ..... My work situation has also deteriorated so I am about to have my income reduced drastically which doesn't help.
It seems to me that your personal circumstances have changed rapidly for the worse, and now you are looking for ways to un-pick a bad decision you made almost a year ago, in order to improve your finances.
You may have persuaded yourself at the time that the car was a good investment, which has not proved to be the case, and now you are regretting the decision.
It's far too late to expect seller to do anything, so all you can do is bite on the pillow and take the loss.
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> It was a club valuation so I assumed it would be reasonably legit.
Club valuations are bound to be high - it's in the interests of all the existing owners to keep prices up.
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Contact the Chairman of the club or is that who you bought it from??
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Check on Ebay to see if any of the model/marque have gone through - that'll give you an idea, but i still think that moaning about the deal you struck 8-20 months ago is far too late.
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I might try talking to the chairman. It's been an expensive lesson I have learnt.
teabelly
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Teabelly,
Let me put this bluntly; you have been woefully naive on this matter. BUYER BEWARE and all that, you don't have a leg to stand on I'm afraid. It was your bad decision, you should have been more circumspect. Sorry to sound harsh, but that's how it is.
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Especially that most of the "faults" I see mentioned are actually consumables. Bushes, pads, hose clips etc. I doubt you would have grounds for representation against dealer after so many months, let alone private seller.
--------------------
[Nissan 2.2 dCi are NOT Renault engines. Grrr...]
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Just for information, the Sale of Goods Act implies four main terms into sales of goods (new or second-hand):
1 The seller has title to the goods (applies to all sales)
2 The goods are as described in any advertisement or statement by the seller (applies to all sales)
3 The goods are of satisfactory quality (applies only to sales by a business; 'satisfactory' takes into account the age of the goods)
4 The goods are fit for any purpose notified to the seller by the buyer (applies only to sales by a business).
There is a fifth term about sales by sample, not relevant to this case.
So a private seller need worry only about 1 and 2 above. As someone above rightly said, description is something specific and factual, not a comment on condition, and certainly not 'decent' which is almost as ambiguous as 'showroom condition'.
There was a classic law case in the 1960s (Beale v Taylor, IIRC) where a car was advertised as '1961 Triumph Herald 1200, white'. In fact it was a 'cut and shut' merger of the undamaged halves of two write-offs (that in itself might not have been conclusive, however unsafe), but the front half contained the engine of a 1959 948 cc Herald. That one was won by the buyer - it was the '1200' that was the misdescription.
Hark, the Herald (ancient) sings
'Description' means specific things.
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this highlights the potential pitfalls of buying a car from a colleague / associate. I say this as I sold my line manager a car for her daughter several years ago. It was a lovely old mark II Fiesta 1.1 with low mileage and full service history. I even had it serviced for her prior to selling it. Despite this the engine seized several weeks later due to a faulty oil pump, which was obviously not apparent at the time. My colleague was very good about this, but I decided there and then never to involve myself with either buying or selling cars with friends, relatives or colleagues.
As far as I understand it you have little comeback if the car was purchased from a private seller, very much a case of "buyer beware". Even if it was from a dealer, I think you may have left it a little late though.
The cheapest way to proceed would be to spend no further money on the car and cut your losses, assuming the original seller doesn't help you out and buy it back. Ebay also never ceases to amaze me as a method of disposing of cars with declared problems.
Good luck.
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