parts?
according to my service info. the only parts replaced are oil, oil filter, and pollen filter (optional).
Value for money? Well somebody has to pay for the nice new shiny showroom.
But at least its well trained staff doing the job! Erm more likely to be the apprentice or youngest doing the services. Any older more experienced staff do the diagnosis, complicated, weirder jobs.
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Synthetic oil at main dealer rates is never cheap.
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I love Saab's - we are on our fourth - but I don't think I would ever buy new because the depreciation is horrendous. Used, they can be a very good buy, especially if you are near a good independant Saab specialist. We aren't near enough to use West Midlands Saab Specialist, but Saab Owners Club people speak highly of them - their prices for the 18k 93 service is £177.
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As someone who has Audi's serviced that sounds OTT for a basic first service (unless they did other items such as brake fluid change) - Audi comes in at about £200 and thats with £90 an hour labour charges. Getting a few quotes from different dealers is always a good idea.
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I love Saab's - we are on our fourth - but I don't think I would ever buy new because the depreciation is horrendous.
I always wanted to own a Saab as I had a great deal of respect for the 9000 and the 95 etc, so I bought a brand new 93SS about a year after they came out. The experience has ensured I never consider a Saab again. Firstly the motoring press lied about the residual values in saying that they would be comparable to Audi/BMW etc, they were not.
Also, as per this thread a high cost of servicing even compared to Audi/BMW. But most importantly of all the cost cutting way they are built and trimmed. After numerous build-quality niggles I got rid of mine prematurely !
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'The motoring press lied about the residual values'. Oh, surely not...
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As an ex (pre-GM) SAAB owner, I can't see why anyone would want to buy a GM offering. It's just too tempting for the likes of GM to use the badge to expensively offload their indifferently engineered mass market stuff onto an unsuspecting public, many of whom would be unaware or dimly aware of the change in ownership.
When my Swedish SAAB was no longer a sensible vehicle for long foreign trips (after 21 years of ownership) I changed it for a VAG diesel. I was aware of this "servicing under warranty" fiddle, so I played VAG at their own game.
Firstly I bought a Passat diesel under the cheapest brand name (Skoda Superb). Secondly I bought it second hand - almost half price at 2 yrs and 20k miles. Big Skodas just don't shift as badge snobbery is alive and well in the UK. Finally. I insisted on a service before sale using 506.01 long life oil, which will take it out of the warranty period before attention is "officially" required.
Of course, I wouldn't dream of leaving the 506.01 or any other oil in the engine until the flag comes up, so I'll change it myself the day after the warranty runs out. It will then get annual oil changes with the long life oil. Depreciation is not an issue for me on the Skoda as I keep cars for a very long time.
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I bought an early 9-3 Tdi in 1999. List price in UK was £22K, I think. I got it in Germany on the Diplomatic net for £15k. It has been largely trouble free apart from a new diesel pump being needed (£1800 and not even common rail!) . It is now worth about £3K. The only aspect of it that is better than ordinary is the very hign quality of the paint finish - It is a good strong metallic red Cayenne I think, and washed and leathered it looks new. However, there has been a shed load of depreciation and I am glad I didn't pay list price for it!
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Good grief - that level of depreciation puts it on a level with my big Skoda.
At least with the Skoda I got a galvanised body and a VW engine with a Bosch fuel system. Coupled with the easy availability of pattern VW parts, maintenance should not be too dear when it gets older. The market penetration of the GM SAABs is just not big enough to ensure cheap spares and I certainly wouldn't have wanted a diesel with a value engineered GM fuel system fitted to it.
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The market penetration of the GM SAABs is just not big enough to ensure cheap spares and I certainly wouldn't have wanted a diesel with a value engineered GM fuel system fitted to it.
They may not be in the same league as VAG for pattern parts but good priced Saab parts are available from GSF and online places such as Elkparts and PartsForSaabs. Some parts are obviously shared with Vectras.
I also have a '99 9-3 diesel, have done 50k miles in 3 years (now on 130k miles), its never broken down and the only items it has required other than oil/filters/brakes/tyres are a heater control unit (a bit steep at £400) and an engine serpentine belt (didnt fail, just got a bit noisy). I don't normally keep cars 3 years (usually get bored of them) but this one has been so reliable I'm keeping it for the forseeable future.
Mine gets serviced at Nottingham Saab at Ilkeston, Derbyshire, an independant who have ex-Saab staff and work to the full Saab service schedule, but at far more palateable rates; are highly regarded in Saab circles and IME have so far been very good.
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As an ex (pre-GM) SAAB owner I can't see why anyone would want to buy a GM offering. It's just too tempting for the likes of GM to use the badge to expensively offload their indifferently engineered mass market stuff onto an unsuspecting public
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You are so right ! This is exactly what GM have done. In fact a GM spokesman said around the time of the acquisition something like "SaaB is a company run by professors in sprts jackets with leather elbow patches, and this has to change". Well this was the esscence of what SaaB was, rather than a company badge on a warmed over Vauxhall with and extra 30% on the price tag !
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Is what GM is doing to Saab (I know we're straying from the point here but ain't that the fun of a good discussion?) that different from Ford's handling of Volvo? The S40 is based on the Focus and the new S60 will be on the Mondeo, but your extra cash buys you a more distinctive looking machine with a rather nicer (I think) interior, as well as a shinier showroom where the coffee is of better quality. You could say something similar of Audi too. We've done the badge snobbery thing elsewhere but there is a little more to it than that. And if you don't want to pay extra, you can have the Vauxhall / Ford / VW product instead and benefit from the same economies of scale.
What really does make me anxious is GM's attempt to rebadge as Saabs vehicles that plainly aren't. A certain amount of the badge snobbery thing is to do with the idea that your car was designed and thought out by a design boutique in a place with an honourable tradition - Volvo, Jaguar, Audi and others trade on this; even Rover managed it quite successfully in the days of the Honda partnership. It doesn't matter too much if some of the engineering comes from elsewhere - buyers these days understand that - but simply sticking a Saab badge on a Subaru will fool no-one and damage the perception of the brand's genuine products too. That sort of damage will take a long time to repair.
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I wouln't disagree. Both Ford and GM are American Companies and have chosen to "highjack" respected (but declining) European badges to bolster their trade. Sharp practice I think.
I'm no friend of VAG, but in contrast, there is a VAG offering for less money than the VW branded product - or more if you want an Audi.
Although not in my sector of the marketplace, I believe GM have also dusted off some old American brand name of theirs in order to sell Daewoos over here. Caveat emptor.
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I agree that GM Saabs do not have the character of the older ones, but then I find most 'new' cars lack character. We have had 2 classic 900 turbos (loved them), a 9000 (liked it a lot) and now a 95 estate. We bought the 95 estate because it is a 5 star ncap rating and at £5,000 for a five year old car (had done 100k miles, though) was affordable - the Volvo V70 was a lot more cash. It feels well-built and comfortable to me - but I'm not driven a Merc estate or 5 series estate to compare. I think if you are buying used they are worth a look. Full service history a must and buy from an independant.
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I wouln't disagree. Both Ford and GM are American Companies and have chosen to "highjack" respected (but declining) European badges to bolster their trade. Sharp practice I think.
can't say i agree.........Aston Martin wasn't hijacked it was rescued and it's doing rather nicely. Similar with Jaguar. Jag would have gone down the pan without Ford's money. Possibly still not out of the woods, but got some exciting new models, build quality sorted...that isn't hijacking to me and neither is it sharp practice.
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Jaguar is like Alfa (and I've owned and enjoyed both). People have been declaring that 'they've got the build quality sorted' for the past 40 years.
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Jag would have gone down the pan without Ford's money. Possibly still not out of the woods but got some exciting new models build quality sorted
I agree. They still have all the qualities (ambience, dynamics, style) that Jags have always had, but with proper build quality, good reliability, and supposedly brilliant aftersales service.
I know the X-Type has its critics, but few would deny that the current XJ is ten times the car the pre-Ford buyout XJ's were.
Just a shame government tax policy and the ecomentalists have all but killed home demand for it.
Cheers
DP
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">SaaB is a company run by professors in sprts jackets with leather elbow patches, and this has to change"<"
I wish I had known that before GM arrived at Saab, I might have bought one. The early Saab turbos were and still are head turners, and who can forget the Saab "Scandinavian flick" rally cars? GM are an odd company, they create mogodon motoring par excellence with Astra/Vectra etc, yet the same company offer that tail sliding Holden thing and the Corvette. I am of the age when sports jackets with leather elbow patches are approaching. Will I look like Steve McQueen in Bullitt?
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Depends where you are in country I guess. Parts £90/Hour labour VAT and there you are!
£90.00 an hour, how do these people justify the charges , im struggling to earn £9.00 an hour
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If you think that is expensive for a SAAB consider yourself lucky you aren't the owner of a 1.4 Polo who writes to HJ today to complain about a £370 bill for a first service!
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The £370 was a quote not a bill.
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I do agree but if the job had been done that is what it would have cost. Was it verbal or written - cross reference to discussion by Qxman of his body shop problems a few days ago!
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