Scenario:
You're about to be rear-ended by someone, lots of squeeling tyres etc, with nowhere to go. One last look in the rear view, and grit your teeth.
What's the best thing to do (other than pray) ... sit hard back in the seat? ... foot hard on the brake? ... head position? ... hands on/off the wheel? ...etc.
Just wondering.
S.
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I am not medical but bracing yourself sound dangerous, and likely to tear muscle etc. I would certainly cover my face with my hands and TRY to relax.
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Brill,
Had just this many years ago with a lorry bearing down on me, all wheels locked up, when I was at some main road traffic lights.
Watched it looming larger and larger in the rear view mirror, took a split second decision, dropped the clutch and shot up the verge.
The remaining space was a lot shorter than my car.
These days I would never have seen/heard it what with a CD Stereo blasting away and the Sat Nav to look at. Well sort of.
David
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I always felt it might not be a good idea to have a loud stereo in a car !!
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If you've nowhere to go then I presume that something is in front. In that case you want to avoid hitting that something hard as you will be thrown forward into the wheel/windscreen.
I would suggest brakes hard on to avoid that.
A properly positioned headrest should stop your head snapping back (many people have these too low), but try to stop your head whipping forward after the impact.
As a pre-emptive measure, do not pull up too close to the vehicle in front at junctions etc., then you WILL have somewhere to go in a potential rear-end and can slow down in a controlled fashion (sort-of) after the impact.
Why DO people insist on stopping less than 3 feet behind the vehicle in front at junctions etc., I wonder?
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Pop the car out of gear to avoid transmission damage / driving into other cars if your foot comes off the clutch. With a smashed rear your car is probably drivable / and easier to repair. As one in five drivers have no insurance I'd look for ways to minimise serious damage to the car. If you are pushed into the back of someone a punctured rad will put the car off the road and with air-con etc it's bound to be expensive. So brakes on hard and head back. If the other driver is insured put in a massive claim for whiplash etc and stick the money in the bank to pay for your increasing insurance premiums from everyone else doing the same / or to compensate for future when an uninsured driver hits you..... (I'm just being cynical).
But far better to leave a bit of room as an escape route.
Piers
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... and straighten out the steering wheel to avoid being pushed in front of any oncoming traffic
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I, like Brian, always go for leaving a good gap if I have to stop on the motorway or at badly placed traffic lights (such as temp lights on dark and windy roads). Has saved the back of my car several times and I've even done a "David" but ended up on the gravel between the outside land and central reservation on the M40 (the car behind me, once the tyre smoke had cleared, was where my car originally had been).
Sadly though it isn't something you probably think about until it happens to you, what Piers says is true - the guy behind could well be uninsured and even if you do get your cash back by court process etc it could be a hell of a long time...
Dan
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I would view all such advice with extreme caution, unless anyone is an expert in this field, which I certainly am not.
For example, the momentum of the car or lorry behind you has to be transferred somewhere and so, if you put the brakes on, will more be transferred to you, the person, relative to your car? The results of this could be horrendous.
I would simply adopt the crash position that airlines use. Leave as much room between you and the steering wheel and your legs and the pedals. Another reason why I would not put my foot on the brake pedal is that substantial damage would be caused if your legs were to become caught up with the pedals.
Like I say, I am no expert and would not like anyone to act on my advice. Leaving aside the law suits, the feeling of guilt would stay with me for a long time. So, whilst this may have started out as as completely innocent thought...
Sorry to be a spoil sport.
Yours
Andy
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Andy
I'd agree. Don't brake - let some of the energy go into accelerating your car, and give the crumple zones more of a chance to work. Get well back from the pedals and wheel, to avoid contact with the inside of the car.
If you've left a reasonable gap, it will minimise the seconday impact with the car in front.
Regards
JS
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re "brace position airlines use"
keep your head away from airbag if you have one, it may well go off in a second or two and is designed to be inflated with your head back...
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I'd also suggest trying to deliberately tug the seat belt so it locks and then you can take up the slack so to speak.
Above advice about getting head back on the restraint I think is good also.
If its going to be a bad one then feet away from pedal area I reckon is a must.
What about if you are sure a bang is totally inevitable turning off the engine before the impact. Difficult call that one as its amazing where you can fit a car in order to make an escape at the last second.
Good points from Brian and Piers about leaving room. If its a queue I always (hopefully) stop quite a bit short if possible, like several car lengths, especially if its a dodgy situation, eg road works just round a bend.
I've heard some say relax and go into rag doll mode, but quite frankly that takes extreme nerve and full harness belts done up really tight to do.
Good thread from Brill, best way to survive any difficult situation is to have thought about it first.
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You could always make a hollywood style dive out of the car?? Could save your own life, and bystanders would be amazed with your reactions and athleticness.
Alternatively, quickly find peace with the good Lord.
Hur hur
Kev
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Oh, fitting a tow-bar may not stop the phenomena, but it sure helps the bodywork in a low-speed crunch!
(The cost of checking the chassis afterwards is leas than a new set of rear lights and some bodywork!)
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There was a crash last week near here.
Poor lady sitting at a junction at the bottom of a farily steep hill: a quarry lorry loaded with stone - the weight could be 38-40 tonnes - smashed into the rear of her car and pushed it into an electricity pole across the road. Cut the power to the village.
The two vehicles then flattened the pole and went on to take a stone wall down too. Lady was trapped under the lorry and airlifted to hospital.
Amazingly the lady lived - so far. I hope she is OK but I wonder what countermeasures she could have taken.
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This Reminds me of an amusing incident when I was driving in France - saw a car and caravan bearing down on me after coming to an abrupt halt due to an accident - so I got out of the way QUICK onto the verge - The guy looked very relieved and was just waving to say thanks, when a Renault Traffic van whacked into the back of his caravan and smashed it to bits.
I Wish I'd been able to catch it on video - was priceless.
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Had this happen to me many years ago on a gloomy wet afternoon in Leeds. I was unfortunately (for the car) stopped at a pedestrian crossing with folk crossing in front of me. I saw headlights in the mirror, thought they were closing too quickly and instinctively clamped my foot on the brake out of concern for the pedestrians. The car behind swung broadside, then the driver recovered it enough to score a direct hit on the back of my '74 Renault 16TX.
The impact was enough to slide my car into the path of a woman pushing a pram. She was taken by surprise because there was no squeal of tyres in the rain. Looking back, I should have hit the horn.
She pushed the pram round the front of the Renault looking at me as though I was scum.
The leg that was on the brake pedal hurt for a few days and my neck hurt too (no head restraints on the Renault).
The other driver was insured and the repair was well done. I forget what he was driving. His car was damaged, but driveable. We didn't tell the police.
But I still wanted to explain to the woman with the pram it wasn't my fault.
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Darcy,
Sorry your reasonable story became cut and paste ammunition. Anyway as Bogush says lets not worry about the woman with the pram, it's the Renault 16TX that is the sleeper in that story. Was it quite new then?
Absolutely superb car at the time. Uncle had one in bright red with grey cloth seats. Very fast and the most amazing lean angles on tiny tyres.
David
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David,
GNW 118N, fabulous car, bought in 1977 at 3 years old to replace a Rover 2000. Fast, economical and a supple ride. It had central locking, electric windows and a metal sunroof with an orange deflector, in other words it had all the toys (for the year). Yes the Michelin Xs did squeal a bit when you got it leant over. 5 speed column change with rods & levers, no stretchy cables. 4 up and a full load, shot across France and gave (uncorrected) 42 mpg. Novel way of increasing the load area, the rear seat back swung UP and was secured to the roof at shoulder level. It was my first engine rebuild when the oil light came on as I was parking at work. Pushed it into warehouse, started dismantling and found bits of oil pump in the sump. Umbrella handbrake working on rear wheels meant longest ever handbrake cables which filled with water and froze in winter. Heater matrix ran the width of the car under the windscreen; great for demisting but bad for keeping the toes warm.
Had enough yet?
Rust killed it off.
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> .............afternoon ............ stopped at a pedestrian crossing with folk crossing .............. saw headlights in the mirror ............ closing too quickly ............... clamped my foot on the brake out of concern for the pedestrians............ car behind ............. score a direct hit ........... enough to slide my car into the path of a woman pushing a pram.
> She was taken by surprise because there was no squeal of tyres in the rain (did it absorb the squeal of tearing metal and shattering glass too?) .......... looking at me as though I was scum.
> But I still wanted to explain to the woman with the pram it wasn't my fault.
Why? Was she blind as well as deaf? And if she was: who let her out unsupervised with a pram?!
A car with its headlights on rams you in front of her in the daytime and she is oblivious to what the traffic bearing down on her is doing, never mind about an accident a car length from her when she's out in charge of a pram!
But I suppose she had been taught that once she had stepped onto the crossing the traffic "MUST" stop.
If she'd been a pram length further forward?
Chalk another one up for our caring, safety conscious rulers.
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From memory, Mrs Pram was looking across the road when I started to slide. It is possible she would not have seen the headlights of the other car anyway because of the broadside manoeuvre. The other driver's headlights were not working after the accident.
That's why I should have hit the horn.
What's your point exactly?
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"From memory, Mrs Pram was looking across the road when I started to slide. It is possible she would not have seen the headlights of the other car anyway because of the broadside manoeuvre. The other driver's headlights were not working after the accident."
"That's why I should have hit the horn."
"What's your point exactly?"
My point was/is:
> .............afternoon ............ closing too quickly .......... score a direct hit ........... enough to slide my car into the path of a woman pushing a pram.
> She was taken by surprise because there was no squeal of tyres in the rain (did it absorb the squeal of tearing metal and shattering glass too?) ..........
Why? Was she blind as well as deaf? And if she was: who let her out unsupervised with a pram?!
A car with its headlights on (was it broadsiding ALL the way down the road? and is that ANY excuse for Mrs Pram not to have spotted it in the daytime?) rams you in front of her and she is oblivious to what the traffic bearing down on her is doing, never mind about an accident a car length from her when she's out in charge of a pram!
The Highway Code tells pedestrians to watch for traffic.
The Highway Code tells pedestrians to wait until it's safe to cross.
Common Sense tells pedestrians to watch for traffic.
Common Sense tells pedestrians to wait until it's safe to cross.
If she'd been a pram length further forward?
Chalk another one up for our caring, safety conscious rulers.
You tell us she wasn't looking.
But you tell us you effectively wanted to apologise to her.
And somebody effectively wants to apologise for me.
Is it any wonder hundreds of pedestrians are killed every year.
And that 96% of them are killed as a direct result of their own actions.
But that 100% of the blame is laid on drivers.
And 0% of pedestrian safety initiatives are directed at pedestrians.
I have a go at the safety gestapo for causing the deaths of children.
But its not really their fault is it?
It IS the fault of drivers after all!
And please, no one apologise for me.
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OK
So no one has had the decency to apologise for me, I'll have to do it myself.
I'M SORRY
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Errrrrrrmmmmmmmmm
Has this mysterious bogush character been censored AGAIN?
And are you sure his deleted post wasn't saying we should be caring about how babies feel when flattened in prams, due to their mothers lack of road sense, rather than about the feelings of mothers not fit to be in charge of one.
Unless, of course the general consensus is that it's all the driver's fault for not having previously personally paid for her to be put through her pram proficiency test and mothering license?
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I think one is either transfixed by the approaching unavoidable crunch ( which then switches to slow-motion mode to prolong the moment) OR, if you have an escape route, you become totally engrossed in extracting yourself and wouldn't notice the crunch if it did hit you.
Rehearsing your actions 'in-the-event-of' in your mind seems to pre-programme your brain so that you're more likely to react effectively when the situation arises and less likely to sit transfixed. If you have to think out the reaction at the time, you've already lost.
I usually slow right down, leaving 100+ metres when I encounter a blockage on a motorway, until the traffic behind has reacted. There's probably a 7 mile traffic jam in front, so why rush to join the end of it? Curiously, many drivers perform erratic lane changing manouevres in this situation.
Imho.
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The same herd mentality which makes people get up and gather their bags at the end of a flight, then stand like morons in the aisle while the plane taxies in.... and then they end up queuing for baggage and customs anyway...
Life's too short to stress about little things.
In M/way situations, I tend to sit quietly, turn up the radio and aircon, and relax - who needs the extra aggravation?
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Apparently you will drive into whatever you are concentrating on - so if you are concentrating on a pileup you are guaranteed to join it.
Mentally practice concentrating on the gaps (try it - easier said than done :-(
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And are you also sorry on my behalf for all the dead kids, who have lost their lives because no one has the decency to stand up and be counted, point out when the emperor isn't wearing any clothes, and when he's spouting ideological claptrap and b*llsh!t?
Instead of apologising to the kids who survived because "normal" motorists prefer to be on a guilt trip and accept responsibility for the homicidal policies of the authorities, and the suicidal proclivities of pedestrians.
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Blimey, what have I started?
I think, having set off across a pedestrian crossing across the front of a stationary car, even the least aware have a reasonable expectation of reaching the other side in one piece. At this point I don't know what was in the pram; it may have been an old telly, some shopping or a child. It wasn't you was it IE?
Mrs Pram did stop when my car was pushed in front of her, so she wasn't suicidal.
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But she wasn't aware that the second car was about to ram you/overtake you/undertake you/was one of a stream of cars/lorries about to overtake you/hit you at 70 and push you 100 yards down the road and into the other non-observers jaywalking all over the road.
If pedestrians aren't aware that even on a pelican crossing with the magic green man glowing steadily there isn't an invisible force field between them and the approaching traffic they shouldn't be on the pavement unsupervised, never mind on the road.
What if the car had hit a couple of seconds later?
What if Mrs Pram had started across a couple of seconds earlier?
And talking of undertaking: why do no pedestrians appear to be aware of the common sense rule of walking on the kerb side of the pavement if they are facing the traffic, and leaving the other side of the pavement clear for people with their backs to the traffic?
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