I've got a Espace 2.2Dt, with 57k mile on the clock ,which has over the last couple of days developed a hum noise from the engine bay. It occurs while driving and gets louder with speed, and disappears at low revs/speeds. It appears to be at its loudest at about 65-70mph. It goes when the clutch is pressed in, so as such I can't get it to happen of the drive to aid me locate it. I've read a few threads on here with regards to the crank thrust washers failing which has got me worried!
Thanks in advance to any advice.
Paul
|
|
Sorry forgot to mention its a 2000 'W' Reg.
|
|
Sounds like clutch release bearing.ie part of clutch assembly.if it is that replace as a whole assembly not just the release bearing.I could be wrong but sounds like it
|
Paul,
The thrust washer problem is serious and we know of several cases associated with this site.
Get it checked out....complete failure costs thousands!
M.M
|
M.M.
I have booked it into my local Renault specialist (not dealer).
Cheers
Paul
|
|
|
|
Mech1,
Thats what my local renault specialst thought, they are going to have a look at it next week.
Many thanks
Paul
|
|
You mention it goes when the clutch is pressed in. Nornally this would ecite the pressure release bearing not shut it up. If you sit in the drive in neutral and play with the clutch at say 2500rpm you would here the noise. Is the same in all gears ?? Check the gear box oil level. Is it getting worse ?? is it throttle dependant, is it high pitched but just gets louder with speed. i.e the diff cluster bearings. Very expensive. Godd Luck, let us know the outcome. Regards PEter
|
Peter,
No noise when parked up and revs applied, only when moving.
I do get the noise in all gears, hasn't got worse since I first heard it, I didn't get it today at all, although I only drove it a few miles.
Its not a high pitched noise but it does get louder with speed. Also, it doesn't appear to be constant (although it's there most of the time), sometimes when I ease of the throttle it goes, and also if I accelerate hard is goes.
Thanks
Paul
|
|
|
|
|
|
Well it does sound worrying.
I had an Espace (S reg diesel 90K miles) which did something similar. Couldn't hear the noise with speed, only when I once parked it in a tight space and opened the door to see what I was doing. Then I heard the noise from the engine. Pressing the clutch certainly made it go as this applies pressure to the end of the crank shaft and stops the thing floating around. In our case the thrust washers had dropped out (or at least half of them had - they are apparently two halves).
The other thing I noticed was that it was getting harder to get into reverse gear. This is because some of the clutch travel is lost in moving the crankshaft.
The garage said the engine had to be replaced as the damage done to the engine case could not be repaired. I was looking at a bill of around 3.5K to get a refurb engine when fortunately someone nicked it from the garage and we got the insurance money for the car anyway!
Renault do recon engines which include everything down to the gearbox - hence the price. You can get other engines from brokers etc.
Anyway, a quick removal of the sump cover will tell all.
Sorry if this sounds a bit gloomy, but after this I had enough of French cars.
----------------------------------
Stephen Khoo
www.khoosys.net
|
A good reason to avoid the Espace at all costs I think!
--
groups.msn.com/honestjohn/problems.msnw?Page=1 - Pictures say a thousand words.....
|
|
|
Stephen,
I don't get the sound at all when parked up, only when driving.
Also, I haven't got any problems with gear selection, so fingers crossed that the thrust washers are intact!!
Thanks
Paul
|
As a fellow espace sufferer I bit the bullet some six weeks ago and dropped the sump off mine. No evidence of the thrust washers falling out but decided on some preventative maintenance as the car is approaching 65k so is nearly due for another timing belt so out came the engine and gearbox, just like that.... in a little under 10 hours. Found the thrust washers to be in place and not in bad nick. The big end bearings were fine but the itsy bitsy main bearings were showing slight signs of wear. Did find that the right hand driveshaft seal was weeping which if the same as yours could let the box oil level fall causing the noise. The other possibility is the clutch itself is noisy.
Whilst the engine has been out I have been able to do all the other little jobs that take forever on an espace like change the cabin filters (requires removal of the complete wiper system) and I have fitted a new oil pump and chain,all the oil seals, water pump, clutch, radiator, breather hoses and replaced all the washing machine hose clips with stainless steel worm drive clips.
My theory is that the clutch goes 'heavy' with age especially on a round town car and this puts the strain on the thrust bearings. My car is definately one of those cars but I put the fact the bearings hadn't failed or worn more to the regular oil changes (3k) and the use of ZX-1 in the oil.
All I have to do now is refit the engine.....
Andrew
Simplicate and add lightness!!
|
My god Andrew! You don't do things by halves, do you??
--
groups.msn.com/honestjohn/problems.msnw?Page=1 - Pictures say a thousand words.....
|
|
|
Andrew,
If I get round to taking the sump off, what should I be looking for?
Cheers
Paul
|
At best nothing but filthy black oil, impending failure will be the presence of metal fines in the oil, at worst as in Stephens case the thrust bearings ( 'u' shaped pieces of flat metal about 5/16" wide by abot 2" radius by 1/32" thick (sorry it is in 'old money' but I was a toolmaker in the 70's)) will be loafing about in the bottom of the sump. Having now done the job I think you may be able to replace them in-situ but in any case I strongly recommend the belt, tensioner and guide roller are replaced. As I said, at 65k mine is now wearing its third belt, the original when replaced at 36k was in a sorry state.
It is a shame really as I think the vehicle itself is brilliant, far superior to the Galaxyalhambrasharan, just let down by 'Gallic Flair'. Would definately put me off buying another French car. If I need another people carrier I shall look to the other side of the 'pond'.
Andrew
Simplicate and add lightness!!
|
Well, i took the sump off and found nothing but nice shiney black oil and nothing else which is good news. I beleive the timing belt is the original, aren't they supposed to be replaced @ 70k, I was planning on getting it done at the next service (60k ish on the clock), also probably get the clutch done, although that might be done soon if it turns out to be the source of the noise.
I'm going to keep the use of it to a minimum until wednesday when the garage are going to look at it, so hopefully I will find out then.
Many thanks
Paul
|
Well, it went to the garage today, the mechanic said he couldn't really make out the noise, so we put it on the ramps and both him and another mechanic think the diff bearing are going. The sound has got louder (to me anyway) from when I started the thread and is also there when the clutch is pressed in. He said, not to worry about it too much but wait until the noise is a lot worse (probably means until he will be able to hear it).
Cheers
Paul
|
If it is making the noise with the clutch in that lets the gearbox off the hook. Diff bearings only audible while on the move so it aint those. Thrust release bearing could be the source but would then go quiet when clutch out as it should no longer be spinning.
Andrew
Simplicate and add lightness!!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
