Hi I own a 2001 Citroen C5 2.2 HDI Exclusive Triptronic, the cam belt broke at 33'000 miles and 2 days out of its warrenty citroen would not repair this even tho they gladly took the £220 off me to service it every 12 months.
I have fitted a new camblet and timed it up correctly but the car still wont start.
I have rang a different Citroen Garage and they said that the computer needs reseting, i have purchased an AutoXray 6000 scan tool and this will clear the code but the car needs to be running.
can anyone please sugest how i can reset the computers on my C5 without taking it to the dealer?
thanks for your help
Paul
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Did you check things like compression testing to ensure that nothing nasty had happened in the engine ?
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yes i have full compression on all 4
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Are you 100% sure you haven\'t got the cam timing 180 degrees out?
I remember once rebuilding a 4 stroke motorbike engine. It had compression, it had a spark, and petrol was getting through, but it refused point blank to start. Cam timing was 180 deg out.
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My dealer told me they got a new engine for a slightly out of warranty C5 when the belt broke at low mileage.
I'd write to Citroen UK and see what they have to say.
If you don't buy another Citroen and tell your friends not to do the same, it will cost Cit a lot more than a new engine!
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Try writing to What Car magazine: they have a good record in pursuing nasty tight manufacturers on claims like yours.
madf
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thnaks i will try that i noticed when i took the broken belt off its was 1/2 inch wide instead of inch and a half i think there is an inbuilt fault with them my 2.0 HDI 306 never let me down its got the same miles on it the only grumble i have is its pathetic on fuel the best i could get out of it was 41 MPG
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The only resetting I have had to do on my C5 is when the electric windows go out of sync. It's simply a matter of disconnecting the battery, counting to 10 - reconnecting and doing a bit of 'window exercising'.
Now I don't suppose for a moment that resetting the ecu for the engine is as simple, but you never know! Certainly, if you haven't tried disconnecting the battery, give it a go. (I suppose to fit a new cambelt 'by the book' you should have done this first anyway.........)
I would have thought that there would be a 'default' setting of the computer that would allow a start on basic settings - only guessing, though. Wish Mr Haynes would get writing....
Graeme
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yes i agree there should be a reset button like on a PC and i was very disapointed to see there wasnt a haynes manual on the C5
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Try disconnecting the battery terminals and joining them together for about 10 minutes. (the leads I mean, not the battery posts). This will ground the ECUs and clear parts of the memory. Just like PCs sometimes they just need to be re-booted.
Re-connect the battery, wait for about 1 minute for the ECUs to re-boot, then try and start the engine.
This works to correct a number of ECU faults on many different cars.
Good luck...
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that makes a lot of sence!
i will try that first thing tomorrow morning
thanks for that i will let you know how i get on i hope it works as i am getting sick of seeing the thing in the garage
thanks mate
Paul
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Hi,
May I suggest a refinement of the method?
If you connect the positive and negative battery leads together, that discharges any capacitance in the system very quickly - potentially with a large current. Although you would be unlikely to cause damage, it is, in theory, possible.
I would suggest disconnecting the positive battery lead, and then turning on the sidelights. This allows the "short" to occur through the sidelamp circuit, which is a much less severe discharge than joining the leads together.
Connecting a sensitive voltmeter between earth and the disconnected positive terminal should show zero volts potential difference between the two after a short period of time.
number_cruncher
number_cruncher
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Hi Number_Cruncher
I will try this now and let you know how i get on
thanks again
Paul
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Hi RailRoad
I tried taking the battery off and shorting the + and - leads togeather and it has made the headlights come on but not woke the engine ECU up
thanks anyway
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A little more info is required I think.
You never previously mentioned the headlights weren't working, but say they are now.
Does the engine actually turn over, or do you just get the ignition lights?
If the engine turns over, are the spark plugs sparking, and is the fuel pump working?
If you get a spark, and there's fuel, have you tried bump starting it?
Not sure if you saw my message earlier in this thread, but are you 100% sure you've got the cam timing correct, and not 180 degrees out?
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i tried takin the + terminal off and putting a volt meter across the terminals and wiating for the reading to go to zero volts and it still hasnt worked
my C5 is the exclusive and the headlights come on by themselves via a sensor on the windscreen
the engine turns over and has full compression on all 4 cylinders i have turned the engine over by hand and the vleves are not catching and have an enormious anount of commpression on all 4
there are no spark plugs as it is a direct injection diesel and i cannot bump start it as its automatic (well triptronic but same thing)
the cam timeing is 110% correct
if u need any more info please let me know
Paul
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When you crank over, does anything come out of the exhaust?, or for that matter get sucked inot the inlet?
Years ago, I worked on a Carlton after the belt had broken. I fitted the new belt. It wouldn't start. I checked fuel, spark and compressions all ok....
When I (eventually!) took the cam cover off, I saw all four exhaust valve rockers had snapped - therefore, no exhaust valves were opening.
Is there anything definite that makes you sure the engine management ECU isn't working properly?
number_cruncher
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there is no smell of diesel comming out the back but there is air comming in and being expled through the exhaust.
i have taken the cam cover off and all is well (all 16 valves) i have set teh cam sensor to the recomended gap.
i have put a multimeter across the diesel injectors and on my 406 the reading is .1 volts when you turn on the ignition and .35 when your turning it over then when the computer tells the injector to fire it sends a 4.0 volt pulse to that injector and the process is repeated, my C5 reads .1 when you turn on the ignition then .35 from there on i am not getting the 4.0 volt fireing pluse to the injectors
Paul
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there are no spark plugs as it is a direct injection diesel and i cannot bump start it as its automatic (well triptronic but same thing)
D'oh. That'll teach me to read things more thoroughly ;o)
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Hi
Silly question, but have you checked the fuel supply cut off switch hasnt tripped?
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Hi,
The next check I would make is to see if there is fuel pressure on the common rail - disconnect the supply pipe, and turn the engine over - make sure there is plenty of fuel.
IIRC, there is a pressure sensor on the common rail, which inhibits injection unless the pressure is ok. May be worth a look.
number_cruncher
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i have took a pipe off the injector and turned the ignition on and it spues fuel everywhere
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Not a good idea Carters, the fuel pressure on an HDi can be as high as 30,000psi. Cracking injector pipes is not recommended on this system.
A better way to see if fuel's being injected is simply to crank the engine and see if there's smoke coming from the exhaust.
I fear only a Citroen dealer can help you now.
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Hi Railroad
i dont get anything comming out of the exhaust, there is no smell of diesel, carbon nothing but it has got the partical filters on it which mean the emmitions are zero. on my 306 2.0 HDI the exhaust is jet black on the C5 its like new not a mark in it.
after all is said and done the C5 is a loverly car and great value for money i would say tho if anyone is thinking of doing any business with spot of chasetown i would advise them no to bother as there aftersales service is crap but i spoke to Davis's moss pits in stafford and they were very very helpfull.
i really think that on the computers there should be a reset button on the computer somewhere on them to stop all this trouble
thanks for your help and sugestions i really appreceate them
Paul
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hi carters, because your not getting injector pulse, i'd have a look at the sensors that supply the computer info. possibly the crankshaft sensor and wiring??
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Hi Jambo
i have checked all the wire's and plugs and i have even de-greased them incase some oil or fuel got in there and its still the same i think the next logical step is to put a hammer throught he window!
Paul
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Carters. Sorry to be obvious, but the failure is either due to the belt snapping (eg damaged valves), something during the repair (eg misplaced sensor connection) or something that has occurred simultaneously (Sod's law at work)
Did no damage occur when the belt went (most unlikely with a diesel) or have you changed valves & cambshaft etc? You speak of good compression. Is this from turning it over by hand, or using a correct diesel compression gauge?
One of the previous writers referred to a sensor which will not operate unless the common rail is at operating pressure. Opening a pipe is not a good judge of pressure, as 4-500psi will be difficult to judge from 20-30,0000, but only Citroen or a diesel specialist will probably have the right gear to check this I suspect.
I would suggest a couple of days away from it. One more check of cambelt timing & displaced wiring, then bite the bullet and take/tow it to a diesel specialist
I have had 3 engines like this that wouldn't start. Gave up on one, and sold it. Found the other (agricultural) failed to give a spark when the magnetic flywheel was correctly tightened (crack at the centre, causing it to distort away from the coils), threw it away.
This motor seems worth spending the money. Good luck
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i found good compression when turning it over by hand but like you say without a diesel guage i will never know for certain
the car is fantastic but i feel that i will have another C5 but not diesel
i will have to get something done i will let you (all) know what it is and how it got fixed IF it gets fixed :(
Paul
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You may well find that a Citroen dealer will have it started in a matter of minutes - either because they have had a similar experience in the past or because they will simply hook it onto their computer and run some diagnostic tests. It might turn out to be quite cost-effective.
Do let us know what the problem is if/when you get it sorted.
Graeme
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Try Paul Johnson at Citroen Centre, Oxford. He did trade as "XM Centre" until around twelve months ago when the C5 took over his sales. He has traded some of the early C5s, so has been up the steep learning curve.
He's ex-Citroen main dealer, but a guru on big Cits from CX, through XM to C5. He no doubt has a quick and simple fix for this.
HTH
rg
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i will email Paul Johnson and let you know what he sugests
and if i have to take it to the dealer i will tell you what it was and how it was fixed
Paul
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i dont think i have much choice in the matter no i think we have exhasusted all the options
Paul :(
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i have spoke to the guy over teh road and he works for the police they have a fleet and he is going to see if there is anything i can do soon as i haer anything ill let you all know
Paul
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i have spoke to the guy over teh road and he works for the police they have a fleet and he is going to see if there is anything i can do soon as i haer anything ill let you all know Paul
A fleet of C5's?
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apprently they have 3 C5's and a fleet of citroen vans that use that engine
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It would make an interesting police chase with a C5.
Think Whacky Races: suspension goes up, drive over the badddies, suspension down. It's another (mini) french adventure.
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LOL YEAH!!!
i must tell you all this whislt i think of it
i brought a CD off ebay with all the techincial data from virtualy every car manifacturer its ace it states the timing marks are in the wrong place
if any of you want this cd.... { 8< snip 8<. By offering to copy and post this CD onto people breaks copyright laws. That is something we cannot endorse through this site. DD}
but the story continues i rang up citroen customer services today and i have been given a claim number and i somehow have got to take my car into a garage and there is a possibility it will be fixed (PLEASE KEEP YOUR FINGERS CROSSED FOR ME) the Phone number is 0870 606 9000
i would really recomend if anyone has had problems with a dealer, ring them up or if you have had a problem with your car as they are really helpfull
thanks for all your help
Paul
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