I have seen a few cars advertised on ebay recently (C1, 107 and Aygo) being sold for possibly next to nothing.
They are virtually brand new, but have suffered various degrees of water ingress into the engine bay while just sitting there.
After which the cars electronics just declare something like "immobilier fault" and won't run.
The people selling these never seem to get them fixed, and the cars eventually go for about £2000 less than what might otherwise be a reasonable price.
Does anyone know why these cars seem to be so willing to die completely if too much water gets under the bonnet, and what the cost would be to fix them.
Since I know of at least three such vehicles, this would seem to be a particular weakness, and maybe another example of the Ctiroen great car, shame about the electrics, and they're taking Toyota down rather than bring Citroen up.
Clearly I don't want to put the C1/107/Aygo on my shortlist as a possible Citry car, if a bit of water under the bonnet results in repair costs of many hundreds of pounds for a few hopelessly overpriced electronic components.
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Bit judgmental there - the C1 engine is a Toyota design as used in the Yaris and Daihatsus.
And the C1/107/Aygo are all built in the same factory, from the same parts suppliers and by the same workforce.
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Yes I know they all come from the same production line, from a 'joint' effort.
I understand that everything except the diesel engine is Toyota, but since both Toyota and C1s are on the market as total non runners due to a bit of under bonnet water, I wonder who did the electronics, and why dealers seem to be happier flogging virutally new cars for parts rather than getting them running again.
Edited by Dynamic Dave on 17/05/2008 at 18:23
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"A bit of water under the bonnet?" Just how deep was this water? The immobilizer is in the BSI under the dash.... [Nothing on e-bay is for real.]
Did a batch of these get flooded in storage and written off - every grubby shyster and his dog seems to be flogging flood-damaged cars at the moment. Anyone who touches one deserves all they get. They should be crushed.
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They should be crushed.>>
What is the mechanism of failure?
OK if ingested water is the cause i can understand major mechanical damage, but if just 'a little water in the electrics'????? OK so water in gearbox oil, or other fluids, but easily changed.
Ok electronics do not work but why?
'Short circuits' of adjacent pins should not cause permanent damage since the interface circuits of all the modules should be suitably protected against grounding, 12v and everything except full ht. The likeliehood of inductive induced 'spikes ' should be minimal in this case.
Corrosion in connectors should not occur short term altho may lead to long term problems.
Dirty water (ie salt laden and therefore potentally conducting) may coat pcbs and provide conducting paths when drying out.
All these issues can be addressed with a systematic approach and suitable knowledge and treatment of affected areas.
Are there other failure mechanisms, eg corruption of code or software that results in a self destruct operation? eg corrupted rolling codes disabling a vehicle, requiring a munfacturer only reset or corrupted codes resulting in a percieved or actual out of spec operation , with consequent limitation of operating parameters?
I can accept that a badly repaired example will cause future owners a problem, but properly addressed surely it should be ok? Like a cut and shut I suppose, very few will be done properly?
p
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I have a C1 (57-reg petrol Rhythm 3-door) and a couple of months ago drove it through floodwater I would estimate at approx 15-18 inches deep at its deepest point. The engine continued to run fine, and there was no water ingress through any of the seals (despite the water level very certainly being above the door bottoms). Was very impressed - if I had known it was that deep I wouldn't have driven through it!
Very chuffed with the car overall, currently returning between 53 and 57 mpg depending on type of driving. Hope that helps!
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yep I can second that with a C1. went through water so deep I felt it starting to lift & could feel the water under the floor pan. No water came through doors & engine didn't miss a beat.
I reckon they have been submerged big time & should be crushed. Any vehicle severly flooded will suffere electrical faults all its life!
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For the last two years our Aygo has covered 8,000 miles and spent everyone of those days and nights living outside. No sign of water ingress causing problems under the bonnet.
No mention of such problems on the owners website either.
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Flood water can contain, amongst other things.....raw sewage, dead animals, toxic chemicals. I wouldnt want to sit in a car thats been exposed to those things no mater how well its been cleaned. You could catch Cholera just by driving to Tescos
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